Roll Call: Latest News on Capitol Hill, Congress, Politics and Elections
October 31, 2014

For GOP, the Damage Is Undeniable

Cruz042213 445x305 For GOP, the Damage Is Undeniable

The Cruz wing of the GOP doesn’t really believe in negotiation, which, at its core, requires compromise. (Tom Williams/CQ Roll Call File Photo)

The deal to open the government and raise the debt ceiling may be done, but the damage to the national Republican Party is considerable.

One GOP consultant — who clearly hails from the more conservative end of his party — didn’t hold back recently in slamming the “no compromise” conservatives who led House Republicans off the political cliff with a government shutdown and by flirting with a debt default.

“We will be weaker when we negotiate with Democrats next time, and we proved that President Obama doesn’t need to negotiate with us,” he said on the condition of anonymity.

The problem, of course, is that the Ted Cruz/Ted Yoho wing of the party doesn’t really believe in negotiation, which, at its core, requires compromise. And while they don’t like compromise, they are particularly unwilling to negotiate with a president they regard as illegitimate and at war with fundamental American values.

But as my colleague Nathan Gonzales pointed out to me recently, “keep fighting” is a motto, not a strategy. And a strategy — or at least one that had even a small chance of succeeding — is something that Cruz et al. have never had.

The political fallout from the confrontation is very real. Republicans got almost nothing out of the deal to re-open the government and raise the debt ceiling except, of course, that they lost another 10 percentage points in their favorable rating and looked less like an organized political party and more like a disorganized, confused rabble.

Republican operatives are worried that the showdown will improve Democratic House recruiting considerably for 2014, and it could well damage GOP fundraising, both among small-dollar donors and the party’s bigger hitters.

Small donors will be disenchanted that Republican officeholders caved on both the shutdown and debt ceiling, while the larger donors, who tend to be more pragmatic, are likely to sit on their cash for fear that the GOP will do something else crazy to threaten the economy and the party’s electoral prospects.

GOP insiders point out that while the party clearly has lost some ground in recent years among swing voters because of its position on cultural issues, the party’s great strength — at least up until now — was that it was generally seen by independents as fiscally responsible and prudent on economic matters. Now that argument may be more difficult for Republicans to make.

Ironically, the House Republicans’ suicide mission came at exactly the right time for President Barack Obama and the wrong time for the GOP.

The president had divided his own party over issues like government surveillance and Syria, and for the first time polls showed Democratic support for Obama starting to soften. The normal second-term fatigue seemed to be developing, which might well have produced a more or less “normal” midterm political environment. But all that changed when Republican Sens. Cruz of Texas and Mike Lee of Utah egged on House conservatives to oppose anything short of complete surrender by the president and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid on Obamacare.

Now, Democrats are united and energized, angry at Republicans’ attempts to destroy Obama’s most important success.

Of course, polls have also shown that Obamacare has become more popular over the past few weeks, in spite of the inept rollout of the program. Instead of being able to capitalize on the snafus, Republicans have talked about the legislative deadlock, robbing themselves of a potentially useful talking point.

As I have previously noted, we won’t know for a while what long-term effects the confrontation will have on the fight for Congress next year. But as one GOP strategist observed, the damage to the Republican brand could hurt the party in 2014 or 2016.

As he noted, “Before the shutdown it wasn’t plausible that Democrats could regain the House next year. It may be plausible now, but we aren’t sure. But a mediocre year in 2014 for Republicans could improve the chances of a Democratic House takeover in 2016, a presidential year.”

“We need to have good years in (what should be) good years, because you know we are going to have bad years in bad years,” he continued, worrying that the last two weeks have turned lemonade back into a lemon for House Republicans.

All of this leaves two questions. First, are we going to see a replay of the last few weeks in January and February, when the current budget deal expires? And second, will a full-scale Republican civil war — which could be played out in Senate races from Kentucky to Kansas and Mississippi — follow?

  • ID-2

    Maybe. Republicans lost without a doubt. But individual surveys from pollsters in AR and SD,, two top GOP Senate pick-up opportunities show that a pluarlty of voters blame Obama and Dems more than the GOP. Also keep in mind that the polls that came out during the shutdown were either purely partisan (PPP) or asked interestingly worded generic ballot questions such as NBC/WSJ. Note the NBC/WSJ poll still found a plurality of voters trusted the GOP on taxes and the debt. Admittedly not much else.

    • billbear1961

      Yes, I have ENORMOUS trust in someone on questions of debt when he’s just refused to pay the country’s bills and brought us THAT close to default and economic CATASTROPHE.

      Don’t make me LAUGH!

      This party’s criminally INSANE irresponsibility and gangster-like threats to DESTROY their own country’s economy if we refused to bow down to their demands means their legitimacy is AT AN END.

      Until they completely repudiate such tactics and apologize profoundly for what they’ve just tried to do to their OWN country, they need to be SENT PACKING.

      If the Democrats had just pulled off a similar coup attempt, threatening the country with RUIN if it didn’t cave in to their demands, the GOP would–at this very moment–be demanding their virtual CRUCIFIXION.

      Tell me that’s not so!

      I NEVER want to hear the accusation of “traitor!” pass through another Republican’s lips!

      Republicans are hypocrisy INCARNATE!

      • Preston Brooks

        Boy, I’m glad to hear somebody tell the unvarnished truth for once. Not only should the evil Republicans lose the House majority, but they should be disenfranchised as well. I propose that Harry Reid introduce a bill that takes the right to vote away from any white, male southerner over the age of 50, and any white, female southerner over the age of 50 with less than a college degree. I further propose that any white, male southerner over the age of 50 should have their property confiscated by the federal government and given to someone another demographic range. I further propose that anyone who opposes President Obama be officially labeled a “hater” by the Southern Poverty Law Center. That enough for you? We must suppress opposition to our dear leader.

        • John Stuart Mill

          LOL good stuff.

        • billbear1961

          Someone is an unhappy fascist loser.

          We will never forget your attempt to subvert democracy in this country, or your threats to DESTROY what you PRETEND to love, TRAITOR.

          Thanks to you, however, and the victory your infamous behaviour has handed us, we are one small step closer to the dawn of the American social democracy!

          Yes, one day we will have a society as progressive, enlightened and JUST as the brilliant and prosperous societies of nations like the Netherlands and the countries of Scandinavia, the finest, fairest and most advanced civilizations that the world has ever seen!

          Long live the President!

          • HenryC

            The Scandinavian countries have much more regressive taxation than the US and have been cutting back on social programs for more than ten years. They have less government intervention than the US and lower taxation after taking account for state and local taxation. They have much lower corporate taxation. I would agree that we should move in their direction. PS 25% of their medical bills do not go the the employees and stockholders of insurance companies.

          • billbear1961

            And yet somehow they manage a just and prosperous middle-class society with equal opportunity for all.

            Talk to Paul Krugman.

            He will explain how funds raised through their VAT (and other taxes) are redistributed–yes, REDISTRIBUTED–to create a PROGRESSIVE society.

            EDIT: The ACA requires a public option, and should eventually give way completely to single-payer universal insurance.

          • JohnG69

            The Scandinavian countries combined have a population smaller than the New York City metro.

            Finland+Sweden+Norway = 19 million.
            NYC Metro = 23 million.

            They also have very different social standards. And don’t have to deal with a large underclass with an entitlement mentality like we do.

          • StingRay

            I can’t tell if you’re being serious or sarcastic. If the former, my God you are a deranged f*ck.

          • billbear1961

            That you think someone is deranged just because he admires the Dutch, the Danes, the Swedes, the Norwegians, etc . . . and the marvels they have achieved tells me ALL I need to know about you, barbarian.

          • StingRay

            The scandinavian countries are being destroyed because of not only socialist policies, but (and mainly) because of “diversity” efforts, which bring in muslims, africans, and other savages. Their murder and violent crime rates as well as their welfare rates are soaring, and unsustainable. White power groups of native people have proliferated (and rightly so). I hope the same thing happens here.

        • Ed Taylor

          What a racist.

      • dcook140

        Here is my solution:
        1. raise debt ceiling by $4 Trillion
        2. Enact VAT
        3. Enact Carbon Tax
        4. Agree to Senate Budget with $1 T tax increases

        Tell me precisely what will happen when the fed quits quantitative easing. Will the interest rates revert to the mean of 5-6%? That should equal $750 B to pay interest. Why not?

        What happened when the Dems ran the House and Senate last time? They passed ACA without one vote from the Republicans.. also without 1 Republican Amendment from either body. Progressives are open and understanding as long as you do exactly what they want.

        • billbear1961

          Debt is where it is because of Reagan and the two Bush presidencies and because of the 2008 MELTDOWN, occasioned by YOUR party’s robber baron economic policies! It is where it is because of MASSIVE tax cuts for the vampiric rich, and an unjust and unnecessary war in Iraq!

          Had Obama not spent like a drunken sailor to SAVE the economy from YOUR catastrophic MESS, the recession would have been one HUNDRED times worse than it was!

          You have done everything in your power to DESTROY the recovery–sequestration as a weapon and now this coup attempt–and NOTHING–ever–to help this president make things better! You have obstructed his every effort from DAY ONE. We know of your foul plots. They are well-documented!

          Things were looking up–more and more jobs, growth, deficits declining, growth in government spending at its lowest rates since EISENHOWER–and you’ve done your damnedest to knock things down because you HATE this good president and cannot accept election results, you evil TRAITORS!

          You know Obamacare (eventually single-payer) will be successful, and your pitch-black Empire of corporate-fascist LIES will be exposed and begin to crumble, never to rise AGAIN!

          You were NEVER willing to cooperate with Democrats to fashion or improve the ACA. You have sought every means to sabotage, starve and destroy it. You are refusing to accept expanded Medicaid funds in states under your vile control! You don’t give a DAMN about people or their health!

          But what is one to expect from a party of depraved degenerates who voted against government-funded healthcare for the children of the working poor under George W. because it “would cost too much” while you approved HUGE tax cuts for the filthy rich?

          What is one to expect from a party of moral monsters who seek savage cuts to food stamps for hungry children, the old and disabled–from a party that expects the helpless and most vulnerable to pay for the society-destroying excesses of Wall Street??

          And now this COUP–and your threats to DESTROY the economy of the country you PRETEND to love if we refused to bow down to your EVIL!

          You love NOTHING–nothing but POWER!

          You are ready and eager to DESTROY what you cannot bend to your fascist will!

          So, don’t pretend you CARE about debt, or the economy or this country!

          One does not threaten the LIFE of those one loves!

          Fascists!

          TRAITORS!

          • Ed Taylor

            When Bush 43 took office, we had $5 trillion in debt. He foolishly added $4.96 trillion to that, and left our debt at nearly $10 trillion.
            In 4 1/2 years, Obama has spiked it another $7 trillion…and wants it to go up further. He & Bush both acted irresponsibly.
            Dems held a temporary ‘super-majority’ where the GOP couldn’t stop them. Dems passed the ACA on lies, and used a faux stimulus to reward their campaign donors in the green industry and unions.
            The Dems stimulus was to lower unemployment by creating good paying, ‘shovel-ready jobs.’ Instead, there were few shovel-ready jobs created and wages & participation in our workforce has gone down…not up.
            Obama is an economic illiterate, who handed Big Pharma & Insurance industry 30 million new captive customers.
            Voters will know which party to thank for spiking their premium & deductible costs when they go to the polls.

          • billbear1961

            The President should have gone after the banksters when he had a chance, but he listened to Geithner!

            We shall see what we shall see with the ACA. I have no doubt the radical right will do EVERYTHING in their demonic and people-hating power to sabotage and destroy it. The Dems NEVER should have abandoned the public option. The ACA must eventually develop into single-payer.

            EDIT: What would YOU have done, hotshot, to prevent economic collapse following the 2008 GOP robber baron Meltdown? Nothing? Wouldn’t have spent a cent?

            Right!

        • littlelizard25

          Regardless of whether or not R’s voted for the ACA it was still passed with a majority in both houses. So the “no repub votes” garbage is pretty meaningless. As for amendments, the R’s proposed over 700 amendments before the ACA was passed, and 161 were actually included in the bill.

        • billbear1961

          Raise taxes on the rich to 45 and later 50%.

          Close all loopholes immediately.

          • hepette

            It’s perverse to weaken our nation’s first line of defense against hunger and poverty by $4 billion per year while giving hundreds of billions to big corporations that don’t need them. Here are a few examples of what your hard-earned tax dollars are spent on:
            $7 billion per year subsidizing the oil industry.
            $600 billion—15 times the value of proposed food stamp cuts—over a decade by allowing corporations to stash cash overseas.
            $1 trillion over a decade be allowing special tax exemptions and loopholes for multinational corporations and wealthy households.
            $137 billion over a decade by not negotiating prescription drug prices.
            Over $20 billion per year on farm subsidies.
            It’s not rational or right, but this is who they are. Conservatives aren’t being fiscally responsible; their policies are destructive to our economy.

          • JohnG69

            Seriously??

            You have any idea what you would do to the economy with such policies? We will be looking back on the great recession and talking about how good it was.

            What happens when you raise taxes on people to level that high?? They cut back on the amount of work they do.

            When you are paying 50% to the Feds on top of local, state, sales, property and everything else why work so much and so hard just to see the government take it all??

            Why not cut back on your hours and make less? Or if you have enough in the bank already just stop working period.

            And think about people like Romney who paid $13 million in taxes. He could sell off all his investment and stocks and pile that money into a zero interest rate savings account and STILL have more money than he could ever spend. Who would loss in that situation? Romney who is still rich or the tax payers who have $13 million less in taxes per year??

            Or did you miss all the stories about how these ‘millionaire’ taxes have backfired in places like Maryland which saw revenue decline $100 million AFTER raising rates on the rich.

      • John Stuart Mill

        Nice MEMES.

        1) There was NO POSSIBILITY of Default on the Debt
        2) We’re running on Pelosi/Reid/Obama’s 2009 Budget, as modified by Sequester

        That’s the fight — whether or not THIS Congress with all the turnover from 2010 is going to have any say on Spending. It’s a CONSTITUTIONAL, Separation of Powers, fight.

        So drop the hyperbole.

        • Nicholas DeLuca

          Drop the ignorance and denial !

          • John Stuart Mill

            You’re continued posting of INCORRECT information tempts me to call you an idiot.

            Rather than trolling with hissy fits (I see one below too), put up factual rebuttals or really, just shut up.

          • Nicholas DeLuca

            You are babbling ! If you posted anything of substance then rebuttal would be possible but you are entrapped in the idiocy , delusion , irrationality, and mean-spiritedness of the TP. Such crap needs to be called out.

          • John Stuart Mill

            Yep. Thought so. Nothing.

            And a Mind Reader to boot…! What finger am I thinking of…?

          • Nicholas DeLuca

            Babble, babble, babble . I can’t imagine you thinking at all .

      • ThisIsNot4U2

        Love your post :-)

        • billbear1961

          Thank you!

      • HenryC

        There was never any chance of default. Huge costs, as Social Security checks were stopped or reduced, but not default. America has more than enough income to pay the interest on our debts.

        • Nicholas DeLuca

          Delusional TP crap!

        • billbear1961

          Yes, you used default to terrorize us because you knew it was really harmless.

          Of course!

          And do you KNOW anyone living on social security? Stopping or reducing their checks is no problem for you?

          Folks, I give you the Tea Party!

          Why do they HATE America??

          • JohnG69

            Obama is the one who talked about default.

            Not anyone else. He was the one terrorizing people.

          • billbear1961

            I would suggest you look at the statements of many of your own people, who said default and economic collapse were necessary to save the “real America” from the “terrible road it was on to socialism.”

            We have your foul and traitorous words.

            They are a matter of public record.

            Of course, you say one thing one day and the exact opposite the next–whatever you think will work with gullible people.

            Fascists have no principles–only a thirst for POWER–power at ANY PRICE.

            TRAITORS!

          • JohnG69

            Please provide me with a quote of an elected official saying we need to default.

          • billbear1961

            ‘GOP Lawmaker Justifies Plunging Economy Into Crisis

            ‘Rep. Morgan Griffith (R-VA) suggested the House
            should reject an unfavorable agreement from the Senate, even if it resulted in a debt default that severely damaged the economy,The Hill reports.

            ‘Said Griffith: “We have to make a decision that’s right long-term for the United States, and what may be distasteful, unpleasant and not appropriate in
            the short run may be something that has to be done.”

            ‘He added: “I will remind you that this group of renegades that decided that they wanted to break from the crown in 1776 did great damage to the economy of
            the colonies. They created the greatest nation and the best form of government, but they did damage to the economy in the short run.” ‘

            http://politicalwire.com/archives/2013/10/12/gop_lawmaker_justifies_plunging_economy_into_crisis.html

          • JohnG69

            I don’t see the word default anywhere in that quote.

          • billbear1961

            He “suggested the House should reject an unfavorable agreement from the Senate, even if it resulted in a debt DEFAULT that severely damaged the economy . . .”

            I can see you just what to play games.

            Play ‘em with someone else, pal.

            The bear is outta here!

          • JohnG69

            He did NOT say default. The Reporter put that word in there or do you not understand how a quote works??

            The whole exchange from the Hill article

            “That’s something the Speaker will have to decide,” second-term Rep. Morgan Griffith (R-Va.) said. “But if the Senate trying to create a time crunch, that’s a time crunch that’s damaging to the American people.

            Griffith suggested the House should reject an unfavorable agreement from the Senate, even if it resulted in a debt default that severely damaged the economy.

            “We have to make a decision that’s right long-term for the United States, and what may be distasteful, unpleasant and not appropriate in the short run may be something that has to be done,” he said.

            Griffith, a former majority leader of the Virginia House of Delegates, cited as an example the American Revolution.

            “I will remind you that this group of renegades that decided that they wanted to break from the crown in 1776 did great damage to the economy of the colonies,” Griffith said. “They created the greatest nation and the best form of government, but they did damage to the economy in the short run.”

            And need I remind you that Obama opposed raising the debt ceiling too and you dismissed that rhetorical, perhaps this was the same thing?

          • JohnG69

            Morgan’s statement on why he did not vote for the bill. Sounds a lot like why Obama voted against the same thing in the past. Morgan like Obama knew it was going to pass anyway thus he voted against it to make a statement.

            Rep. Morgan Griffith, R-Salem: “In our legislative process, each side must give up some priorities to come to a common agreement. Over the past several weeks, my colleagues and I made numerous attempts to compromise, but the President and the Democrat-controlled Senate never negotiated in good faith with House Republicans. In fact, while House Republicans were considering a proposal that would have only required the President and his political appointees to live under Obamacare like the rest of the American people, the President told House Democrats that he would veto any debt ceiling bill that included that provision. If Obamacare is good for the goose, why is it not good for the gander?* Further, the final agreement’s only ‘concession’ to Republicans is that the Administration follow what is in existing law – that Americans receiving taxpayer-funded Obamacare subsidies be required to verify that they meet income eligibility requirements.

            “However, Republicans don’t control the White House or the Senate, and we did not win this Obamacare battle. But I continue to believe that the health care law is a train wreck that can not and will not work, and remain committed to seeing it repealed and replaced.

            “It is true that this evening’s Senate amendments raise the debt ceiling for nearly four months and put us on a track to negotiations to agree to a budget for the first time since 2009. But the President, who once called letting the debt rise unchecked ‘unpatriotic,’ has been insisting that he won’t negotiate over raising the debt ceiling. While hopeful, I am skeptical that the President and Senate will change course, and come to the table to constructively work with Republicans to rein in the federal government’s spending addiction. We need a clear, disciplined, well-thought-out spending reduction plan in order to decrease our deficits and our debt, preventing us from further burdening future generations of Americans with excessive debt. For that reason and others, I could not in good conscience vote in favor of the Senate amendments.”

          • billbear1961

            Roll Call: “While Democrats refuse to negotiate on the continuing resolution and the debt limit, apparently assuming the GOP will eventually cave, House Republicans insist they are prepared to bring borrowing authority to a screeching halt.”

            http://politicalwire.com/archives/2013/10/09/many_republicans_insist_default_wouldnt_be_bad.html

          • billbear1961

            GOP Representative Steve King of Iowa has repeatedly said it may be necessary to inflict economic pain on America to take her “off the wrong road she’s on.”

          • JohnG69

            The pain is going to happen one way or another.

            We cannot continue to borrow at this rate. So we either cut back now or we cut back later.

            BTW in our entire history revenue has exceeded 20% of GDP one time. Today we are spending 22+% of GDP. At this rate we will HAVE to cut spending or else we will never have a balanced budget again.

            Unless you think we can tax the rich to the tune of $600 billion more per year?

    • Marcus Lindroos

      > individual surveys from pollsters in AR and SD,, two top GOP Senate
      > pick-up opportunities show that a pluarlty of voters blame Obama and
      > Dems more than the GOP.

      Undoubtedly true, but how will this help Republicans in future presidential elections? I regard it as very likely that the GOP will win Tim Johnson’s vacant seat as well as defeat Mark Pryor in AR. The big problem is Ted Cruz’ and Mike Lee’s strategy plays poorly in non-red states. Republicans even worry that the RINO vs Tea Party fight may help Democrats Allison Grimes and Michelle Nunn in Kentucky and Georgia (the GOP also lost winnable races in 2010 and 2012 for the same reason).

      What we saw during the shutdown is Tea Partiers increasingly approved of Cruz and Lee whereas Republicans in general regarded them less highly as the crisis dragged on. At least that’s what the opinion polls are saying. Similarly, the so-called “GOP House suicide caucus” all represent rural districts where the GOP is more popular than ever and where Obama lost by 23% on average. So are witnessing polarization, with the majority of the country siding AGAINST the Tea Party.

      • John Stuart Mill

        The strategy for 2016 runs through Ohio, Michigan and Wisconsin, that’s just analysis. It depends on two things — one is the possibility/probability that Obamacare will go over like a fart in church.

        The other is Hilary’s stroke damage — dysphasia and motor tics evident in videos — and the Dems have nobody else.

        Should be interesting, eh….

        • Nicholas DeLuca

          Where do you get the preposterous crap you post ?

          • John Stuart Mill

            LOL you post that and only that … and call my post crap…? Troll. Very Troll.

            My comments on strategy were opinion, as was my pointing out the OBVIOUS that IF Obamacare goes poorly THEN it will impact elections.

            And IF it goes well … it will impact elections. Feel better?

            As for Hil’s stroke, I noticed the dysphasia myself and out of curiousity, reviewed some videos with a couple of docs — Duke and Hopkins residencies — she’s got some damage, poor gal. That’s all I said. You’re awfully thenthitive….

          • Nicholas DeLuca

            Still preposterous crap . TP parroting without substance.

      • ID-2

        Two points. 1) More Dems sit in safe districts than the GOP according to 2012 Presidential results. 2) This only hurts the GOP in 2016 if they do not nominate one of their governors.

        • Marcus Lindroos

          > This only hurts the GOP in 2016 if they do not nominate
          > one of their governors.

          Probably true … although I also suspect “conventional” (i.e. Tea Party) governors would be at a disadvantage.

          Someone who is able to distance himself (herself) from the combatants in Washington might have a chance, though. I think Chris Christie fits this description whereas Scott Walker or Bobby Jindal do not.

          • ID-2

            More likely true than not. I suspect Jindal never had a shot and that Christie, Kasich or Walker would be the strongest candidates.

    • GREENWOLFE GREEN

      I hate to put a little cold water on your comment but you may have forgotten that the PPP poll was THE MOST ACCURATE poll taken in the 2012 election cycle. It may be a partisan poll, but it is accurate. And that is the imporant thing. Unlike conservatives, progressives can handle the truth.

      • subframer

        omg, lmfao. sure ya can. the truth on keynes, redistributionism, the NSA, IRS etc etc. ha ha ha, that’s funny.

    • Nick Noble

      This is true, but what that means is that Republican primaries in those states will be BRUTAL, as Tea Party extremists challenge moderates, dividing their base by creating the “full-scale Republican Civil War” that Rothenberg mentions at the end of his piece. Given recent events, despite a majority generally blaming Democrats and supporting generic “Republicans” in AR and SD, it is just as possible that a lone Democrat would be running against two opponents, one Tea Party and one traditional Republican, giving the edge to the Democrat.

      • billbear1961

        A little internecine brutality will do the fascists some good.

        God KNOWS they like to dish it out to others.

        Stand up to them, though, and they start crying like babies–or astonished bullies.

      • ID-2

        Perhaps. But right now not even Kentucky fits your scenario.

    • godblessusa

      Most voters in those states blame Obama and Dems if it rains.

      Those polls also showed the Dem senate candidates leading or considerably closing the gap.

  • billbear1961

    Let’s leave every other issue aside–every other strong argument we could make against the corporate-fascist GOP, okay?

    This one issue is enough–all by itself–to utterly destroy this party of selfish, bigoted, evil maniacs: they threatened to DESTROY their own country’s economy if we did not agree to allow them to subvert our democracy and replace majority rule with a fascist Tea Party tribunal!

    Do you understand the implications of that? DO YOU?

    The media may carry on as though we just went through “business as usual,” but even a CHILD can see that these gangsters have finally gone TOO FAR in an overreach of truly EPIC proportions!

    These godforsaken ANIMALS–these fascist TRAITORS–threatened the economic LIFE of their OWN country if we refused to bow down to their dictatorial rule!

    Nothing excuses that! Nothing can mitigate it! NOTHING!

    And if you think we will EVER let them forget what they tried to do to our democracy, you are SADLY MISTAKEN.

    Indeed, you are DELUSIONAL!

    • Marcus Lindroos

      I wholeheartedly agree with you.

      The good thing is their despicable extortion tactics backfired badly. This was an epic humiliating fiasco on so many levels. While I am sure Cruz & co. have learned absolutely nothing, it seems quite likely the so-called “RINOs” have. And this means there probably will not be similar high profile hostage taking showdowns in the foreseeable future. Republicans who criticize this strategy can now cite 1995 and 2013 as evidence shutdowns won’t work.

      • Michael Modes

        Extortion. AWK!

        Would you fine parrots care for some suet?

        If Obama said “Hemoglobin Cheesecake” you would be citing that.

        Please, have some birdy num nums my little mechanical bird.

      • John Stuart Mill

        This was about the GOP Primaries and nothing more. Over 200 districts elect the GOP Nominee, period.

        The rest, the General in 2014 and in 2016, will depend on Obamacare.

        You really don’t think those antics in Washington are real, do you? They’re the Puppet Show for you to stare at….

        • hepette

          really it was about stopping anything obama puts forward. if it has obama name attached to it then its NO

          • John Stuart Mill

            Perhaps, for some.

            Thanks for posting in a civil manner.

      • John Stuart Mill

        BTW … Government Spending beyond the “basics” — rule of law, courts, basic infrastructure of government — has been UNEQUIVOCALLY proven to hurt Economic Growth.

        You know, that thing that made us a prosperous society in the first place…?

        You know, that think raging in Singapore (17% govt) who’s passed us in per capita GDP, that thing raging in China (21% govt) … that thing stagnant here in the USA (42% govt)…?

        45 YEARS of OECD data. Fits the theory (Austrian, which works, not Keynesian, which demonstrably does not.)

        If you don’t work for government, and you care about the country, you may reconsider some of your beliefs and/or respond with considered argument.

        Or just post an insulting rant and call names. Your choice.

    • Michael Modes

      Did you wet your pants? Fascist tribunals? Are you five years old?

      Thanks for the entertainment! Take some pills. It will be okay.

      I think you would love a fascist country with no political opposition.

      That is usually the subtext of hysterics like you.

      • Michael Modes

        And CAPITALIZING words does not make them more MEANINGFUL little BEDWETTER.

        • billbear1961

          Go wipe your nose, sweetheart.

        • John Stuart Mill

          I tend to all-caps in lieu of italics. Is there a way to do italics for emphasis…?

          • billbear1961

            So do I.

            I just like the way it makes words stand out.

            There IS something you can do to italicize. I forget what, exactly, but it’s more time-consuming.

            All-caps is faster!

          • John Stuart Mill

            Ya know, it appears from posts that we’re not on the same page politically, but I appreciate your civility in your response all the same.

            I’m not perfect, but I try to keep it civil and respond in kind to reasoned argument as well as ad hominem. Unfortunately, there are far far too many trolls posting “nah nah’s” and far far too much Projection — it’s like an Alinsky Seminar of how to “win” a playground shouting match, but lose if you enjoy good debate. This comes from both “sides”

            Just a footnote, but I’ve been plastered as TP and Republican for no other reason than I, as an economist, point out that historically, private sector spending is what drives growth. This is uncontroversial in economics. That’s it.

            I don’t know if I have a point, but it would be nice if people would actually debate on what others said and not what they think they think, or they groupthink, or whatever.

            Example: I saw that McConnell tacked on $3 billion for a Kentucky dam or something. I’d like to be able to say “What b*llshit…!” without people assuming I mean anything but that. End of non-rant….

          • billbear1961

            You’ve got to understand that many of us are on edge after this fascist coup attempt, John.

            It and the threats to destroy the economy that accompanied it were an unprecedented attack on our democratic system!

            If it had succeeded, it would have meant government by extortion: “Do as we say, or ELSE!!”

            What is the point of VOTING if we allow our democracy to be hijacked in this way??

            And what does it say of a people, John, if they do not punish politicians who threaten the economic LIFE of their own country??!!

            Imagine the Republican reaction if radical DEMOCRATS had just attempted such a stunt!! “Do as we say, or else we unleash economic CHAOS!!”

            They would have screamed TRAITORS at us, and would now be demanding our virtual crucifixion! You know that I’m right!!

            Those who threaten their country in this fashion in the pursuit of POWER must be punished for their traitorous crimes, or our whole democratic system of government will break down!!

      • billbear1961

        Opposition is supposed to be LOYAL.

        Look it up, Mussolini.

        Sorry, I meant Republican!

        These days, especially since your coup attempt, it’s very hard to tell the DIFFERENCE!

        • JohnG69

          Really??

          So all the Democrats who called Bush Hitler we being loyal??

          • billbear1961

            Where was the coup attempt by Democrats, traitor, and threats to DESTROY the country if our demands weren’t met? WHERE??

            “Give us what we want–all our policies that were REJECTED in the elections–or we shut down government and refuse to pay the country’s debts! Give us what we want. Do this! Undo that! Or we DESTROY the economy; we unleash CHAOS!”

            You’ve gone WAY too far this time, gangster.

            And many in the country are waking up to WHAT YOU ARE.

            And they DON’T LIKE IT; no, not one little bit.

            Even your corporate sponsors, who want you to destroy the progressive tax system and ALL the benefits, safeguards and regulations our parents and grandparents fought for over the past CENTURY, are highly alarmed at your RECKLESS DISREGARD for the country’s economic well-being.

            They don’t give a DAMN about the 99%, but they sure LOVE their goddamned FORTUNES!

            EDIT: We find ourselves in the economic situation we do because of George W. and his robber baron policies that led to the 2008 MELTDOWN.

            Obama’s careful stewardship helped prevent outright collapse, but YOU have done EVERYTHING you could to harm the recovery–sequestration and now this fascist coup attempt and threats to DEFAULT–all out of insane HATRED for Obama and social progress.

            All because you cannot accept ELECTION RESULTS, and the notion of universal healthcare, a concept that has been LAW for half a CENTURY or LONGER in every other industrialized democracy in the WORLD.

            You are ruthless–and MAD!

            And now, in the past two weeks, the people have SEEN for themselves how DANGEROUS you are!!

            We will NEVER forget what you have tried to do to your OWN country!

            What you cannot bend to your wills you are determined to DESTROY! When did Democrats EVER behave like this? WHEN??

            You are not patriots–you are power-mad fascist TRAITORS!

            The coup attempt, with the accompanying terrorist threats, PROVES IT!

          • JohnG69

            “Give us what we want–all our policies that were REJECTED in the elections–or we shut down government and refuse to pay the country’s debts!

            Obama voted against the debt ceiling increase so he must be a traitor, right??

            And please get back on your meds.

          • billbear1961

            He was wrong to do so and has admitted as much.

            But his vote was an empty gesture with no serious threat of becoming reality.

            I believe you have understood the points I’ve made and why what the GOP did was traitorous.

            I think MANY Republicans understand and are ashamed of what they let these Bagger THUGS make them do!

            Confess! Repent! Apologize, and disown the fascist scoundrels who infect your party!

            Or carry their CURSE and their TREASON–their betrayal of their country–on your conscience till the end of time!

          • JohnG69

            Tell me, did default become reality??? Or was the Republicans ‘threat’ (which wasn’t really a threat) an empty gesture??

            And you see to not understand that not raising the debt limit does not mean default. Not even close.

            If you credit card maxes out and the CC company refused to up your limit does that mean you can no longer pay the interest on that card??

            We bring in more than enough revenue to pay off our debts. The only thing a lack of raising the debt limit would do is cause massive government cut backs since we would actually have to live within our means.

          • billbear1961

            It is not disloyal to oppose what someone is doing. That’s what it means to be “in opposition.”

            But when opposition threatens to unleash CHAOS if its demands are not met, THAT is disloyalty.

            It is TREASON!

    • danaellen

      You will get your fascist government thanks to Obama

    • John Stuart Mill

      1) Corporatist — you mean both Parties? I see no reduction in Corporate Welfare from Democrat control. In fact there’s more, not to mention Obamacare — Trillions more to Big Healthcare. Wake up.

      2) Fascism — you mean the National SOCIALIST German Workers’ Party…? Read up … learn some history, understand Fascism is another flavor of Big Government, Small Liberty.

      Indeed, your delusions may stop.

      • Gentil Aquitaine

        What we have had for the past 4 years is a game of good-cop / bad-cop. The latitudes of acceptance have shifted further to the right—just as they did during the Clinton Administration. We kid ourselves when we buy into the myth of divided, representative government. It is neither divided nor representative (of us, anyway).

        • John Stuart Mill

          Hey! A reasonable, polite post. Actual analysis. Thanks, for all comment readers everywhere….

      • Nicholas DeLuca

        Your understanding of Fascism is as delusional as your TP ideology.

        • John Stuart Mill

          And you’re merely a basement Troll who never posts anything to rebut, just hissy fits. Go to your momma, punk. You’re boring.

          • Nicholas DeLuca

            And, you are still babbling !

      • skylights

        Irony — Internet commenter says the “Socialism” in “National Socialism” meant the Nazis were socialists; lectures people to learn some history.

        • John Stuart Mill

          While I was admittedly using that rhetorically, the name of the party is a historical fact. Or are you disputing that?

          More likely, I expect, you’re questioning whether Fascism is indeed a variant of Socialism. I believe I addressed this by calling it “another flavor of Big Government, Small Liberty” rather than getting in the weeds defining the term “Socialism” … or are you saying it is not?

          Not meaning not what I said, rather than what you think I said.

          Your second paragraph is simply inane. Mind Readers abound these days. Remarkable.

      • billbear1961

        There WILL be a reduction in corporate welfare if he listens to the true progressives in the party, John, the social democratic left.

        The BIGGEST mistake Obama has made–aside from trying to placate Republicans, who simply HATE HIS GUTS–was when he let the goddamned banksters off the hook. He had a chance to kick the living CRAP out of them, but listened to that corporate lackey Geithner!

        I don’t think the Baggers are Nazis–YET.

        Their brand of fascism–corporate fascism–would result in a government so emasculated in many of its functions–social welfare and necessary regulations–that we would be the total SLAVES of corporate gangsters, the robber barons.

        We’d hear, “Do as you’re TOLD, or you’re FIRED and into the gutter with you, where you’ll STARVE!” We would have no recourse, no rights, no benefits, no security, nowhere to turn for help against the most powerful in the land!

        The Religious Right would use what was left of government to control every aspect of our private lives, dealing out punishment for all “sinners.”

      • billbear1961

        Bagger fascism has more in common with Mussolini and his ideas about corporatism, the Corporate State.

        Government would be totally dominated by corporate control, even more so than it already is.

    • JohnG69

      I don’t understand the “subvert our democracy and replace majority rule”

      Do the Republican not control the majority of the house??

      How does the house majority doing what it wants subvert the majority rules idea?

      And answer this for me: did everything you just said apply to Obama when he voted against the debt ceiling increase as a Senator?

      • billbear1961

        What they tried to do—and with a gerrymandered majority in the House—was UNPRECEDENTED.

        Never before has Congress shut the government down to try to GUT the Law of the Land, to try to force through by EXTORTION all the policies that LOST them the general election at the nationwide level. (The policies were CLEAR, and Romney views were soundly REJECTED!)

        You don’t have the VOTES to enact or repeal LAWS, so you refuse to DO YOUR JOBS—your constitutional DUTY—unless
        you get what you want!

        Never before has a party that LOST both the White House and Senate allowed a MINORITY of its caucus in the House to bully (with threats of political reprisals) the rest of its members
        into shutting down government and threatening to violate the 14th Amendment by refusing to defend the validity of the public debt of the United States unless government bowed to their DEMANDS.

        To have given in would have meant renewed demands in the future—again and again and again—for government to
        do whatever they wanted . . . or ELSE!!

        It would have meant government by EXTORTION, government by fascist Tea Party tribunal!!

        “Give us what we want, or we DESTROY the economy!!”

        Never before has a major political party in the U.S. EVER threatened to unleash economic CHAOS if its demands were not met!!!!

        You would make majority rule IMPOSSIBLE, and would totally subvert the normal democratic process.

        This is something you would have NO trouble understanding if “radical” DEMOCRATS attempted to pull the same stunt from THEIR side of the political spectrum.

        Tell me that you wouldn’t scream TRAITORS at them, and demand their virtual CRUCIFIXION!!

      • billbear1961

        Mr. Obama was wrong to have voted against its extension.

        But it was an empty gesture that posed no serious threat of default at the time (if it had, if the numbers had been great enough, we would have heard much more about it at the time).

        He has admitted it was wrong.

        Sometimes our foolish mistakes from the past come back to haunt us.

        This time, however, voting against raising the ceiling could easily have resulted in just that: no raise, and DEFAULT.

        The threat of its actually happening was very REAL.

        Yet many considered doing just THAT and unleashing CHAOS upon the country they CLAIM they love!

        MADNESS!!

    • Jilli Brown

      Can anyone name any proposals put forth by republicans that would entice you to vote FOR them?

      Spare me the small government, fiscal conservatism, restoring our liberties/freedom hooey – they’ve been pushing that tripe for decades and have never followed through. Why should we vote FOR republicans?

  • birdfish

    HAHAHAHA TEA PARTY! YOU LOSE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    You guys have DOOMED your chances!
    GOOD RIDDANCE!
    YOU ARE INCOMPETENT AND UNFIT TO GOVERN!
    You are on the way to the DUSTBIN OF HISTORY!
    SAY HELLO TO THE WHIG PARTY!!!!!
    HAHAHAHAHAHA!

    • danaellen

      HA HA! You win and get a bankrupt country with less freedom.

      • birdfish

        WRONG!
        Deficit spending is going DOWN. The number that matters is debt as a percent of GDP you big DUMMY!
        And under our presidents TERRIFIC LEADERSHIP that has been going DOWN.
        But you don’t get that because like all tea party members YOU ARE STUPID.
        That is not a flame but a FACT!
        When you ignorant non-science believing DUMMIES are TOSSED OUT OF OFFICE next year the President will REFORM THE TAX CODE, RAISE TAXES AND CONTINUE TO IMPROVE THE DEFICIT!
        Now go back to thumping your bible in anger!
        HAHAHAHAHAHA!

        • hepette

          dont forget the repuke/bagger fiasco costs us about 43BILLION

          • Prodius

            That’s furloughed pay, use your brain.

        • Jerry S.

          They will repeat an Obama talking point — “our deficits are falling at the fastest rate in 60 years” — that is both technically wrong and selectively misleading. The deficit is indeed shrinking, comparative pace notwithstanding, but the nation’s incredible debt load is not. In fact, the Congressional Budget Office’s 2013 Long-Term Budget Outlook shows that the $16 trillion federal debt — already high by historical standards — will continue to grow even under some optimistic assumptions about future spending restraint. Already, the debt is 73 percent of the economy’s annual output, and CBO projects it expanding to an astounding, practically unfathomable 100 percent of GDP by 2038. The longer we wait, the harder it gets.

          Listen and watch the president. If he declares victory over the GOP or plays down the deficit problem, he is not serious about leading the country out of the fiscal and political wilderness.

          http://goo.gl/y2zmUW

        • rick550

          Jeez, really doesn’t matter what you think is right. If you have a credit score of 700 or above you ought to understand this. At our current debt…if the interest rate rises (and it will) to 6%….we will have to PAY 800-1,000 billion on interest on the debt alone (at current debt levels). The ONLY reason there isn’t an immediate crisis is due to QE. That WILL end.

          So unless there’s incredibly robust growth and/or HUGE spending cuts…you’re wrong. You’re not even close to being right.

        • Prodius

          Lol deficit spending is down if you disregard Obama’s 2009 spending prior to October 1st of that year.
          You see Obama added $1.2 trillion to bush’s last budget (Bush actually passed 8 of them like the Amendment to the Constitution requires).
          So Obama’s lower deficits this year would be the highest on record if not for the previous 4 years and the fact that they froze the debt clock 151 days ago.
          liberals live in a fantasy world that they hope others will just take their word on.

      • Nicholas DeLuca

        Not really. Delusional TP economic theory is now exposed as…well ,delusional !

        • billbear1961

          “Give us what we want or we will destroy you ALL!”

          “We must destroy the country to save it!!”

          Tea with cyanide, courtesy of our very own homegrown Fascist Party

          • Prodius

            Fascist used state capitalism (Obama and the Fed’s current economic policy), an ideology of the Left.
            Liberals try to claim National Socialism is far right, no right party espouses state capitalism, it’s anti-free trade and capitalism.

        • Jilli Brown

          It’s chucklehead economics. Complete denial of reality makes it real. Kind of like trickle down economics – it’s only a success if you deny reality.

      • Jilli Brown

        Specifically what freedoms have you lost?

        The freedom to be gauged by your insurance company? The freedom of sure bankruptcy if you suffer a major illness? Oh, how about losing the freedom to be dropped by your health insurance company if you get sick. Are those the type of freedoms you’re referring to?

    • John Stuart Mill

      Do you work for, or directly benefit monetarily, net net net, from the Federal Government…?

      If so, then your post is rational wishful gloating in your own interest.
      If not, you’re dumb as a brick.

    • ThisIsNot4U2

      Nice one @bird ;-)

    • S. Strengari

      UNFIT TO GOVERN? Wow- I think the idiots in Government who have been kicking the can down the road for the past few decades are unfit. But go ahead mock and laugh. That’s a good way to bring people together. Following your lead from the Great Uniter I see.

    • Ed Taylor

      Dems answered the Tea Party by creating the…what was the name…oh yeah, the Coffee Party. How many members are in the Coffee Party caucus?

  • Mundus611

    FOXNEWS JUST INTERVIEWED THEIR REP FROM WALL STREET, WHO REVEALED OBAMA CALLED IN THE TOP FIRMS TO PRESSURE- ONSIGHT- THE REPUBLICANS, INCLUDING Goldman Sachs, etc. They promoted the line about how badly the country would be hurt. Exactly , how do these financial genii retain their ‘ incorruptible’ status, and how do they not know, or promote, that
    this kind of debt increase, is increasingly detrimental to the country, its future, and that of their own children and grandchildren? Or maybe, the question should be, how much are they making from an increased debt on our backs? Why don’t they go to Congress and plan how to put a stop to all of this? I would bet, those out in the country, who support the goals of a Constitutional Republic, have only increased in number. Obamacare? Just watch. Why should we be paying 75% of the Congressperson’s healthcare program when so many are multi-multi-millioniares? Why should they get a delay? How long do you think people will put up with this absolute corruption? We are paying for our own self-destruction and most people know it. THe collusion of the press in all matters Obama does not
    kill the truth.
    This Congress and Administration are corrupt, greedy, stupid, lacking all foresight, or care for the People and job they serve, and are on the historic record as being so. What a legacy.

  • Maypo

    Yep, Cruz and his gang did not help a whit. He may be a top-tier intellectual — but doesn’t seem to have some basic political street smarts. Better to keep your powder dry while watching the ACA collapse like a house of cards. While the Dems will try now to move attention to other issues — the Rs should focus like a laser on the “reality” of the ACA. It ain’t going to be pretty — revealing the “unintended consequences” on those who were told it would not affect their existing health care plans, the “misleading” promises about affordability to those who sign up (the high deductible and out of pocket costs will make the premium subsidies look laughable), and the incompetence of the Feds to implement complex social programs (the IT problems are driven by the 2000 or so pages of the ACA rules and regulations). Cruz and the gang were too dumb to understand when, and when not to fight. Lesson moving forward — now is the time!

    • Gentil Aquitaine

      Cruz is indeed a McCarthy like figure… plenty of smarts but driven by hubris to what is likely to be a tragic end. (It wouldn’t surprise me if he were an alcoholic.)

      • Maypo

        Not going to demonize Cruz. His tactics and approach to fighting the Dems was simply wrong — not evil.

        • Gentil Aquitaine

          Self-serving is the word I would use, not evil. He’s a bright and ambitious huckster as was McCarthy. And, like McCarthy, he doesn’t care who he hurts if it empowers him politically. Time will only tell if he as self-destructive as McCarthy was.

        • billbear1961

          Wrong AND Evil.

          The man is a liar and a fascist demagogue.

          The more people get to know him the more they hate him.

  • danaellen

    Idiot liberals want to see a president with an unlimited check to spend as much as he wants.

    • Gentil Aquitaine

      We had eight years of the that President. He was the Neocon’s wet dream. Obama is very much an acolyte of expansionary austerity. And he’s likely to cut Social Security and Medicare by the time his term is up.

  • John Stuart Mill

    POPPYCOCK.

    The victory was the ESTABLISHMENT over the Insurgents in the GOP. But that was the intent, I believe, of the Insurgents. This is all about REPUBLICAN PRIMARIES — in the over-200 districts where GOP Nomination = WIN.

    (BTW Dems can thank the Voting Rights Act, not gerrymander, for that)

    Personally, I’m sick and tired of the Establishment. Bush – Clinton (who joined) – Bush – Obama (manufactured by) …. SPENDING us into Oblivion. The FEDERAL RESERVE, the Monopolist PRIVATE BANK blowing and crashing Bubbles. 7 of 10 Richest Counties suburbs of DC, the other 3 suburbs of Wall Street.

    So I hope the Insurgents win the GOP. The Establishment, the Wall Street – Washington Axis of Evil, with the Fed as its linchpin, has DONE ENOUGH DAMAGE TO THIS COUNTRY, mostly with SPENDING (see graph, 45 years of OECD data).

    Next Big Business and the Chamber of Commerce want to LEGALIZE millions of Illegals who take Jobs and depress Wages for LEGAL Immigrants and Native Born Americans.

    The Enemy is among us. Enjoy their PUPPET SHOW, but make no mistake, they’re not FOR us. As Obamacare rolls out remember one thing please — all the money, the premiums, the subsidies, ALL OF IT goes to Insurers, Hospitals, Doctors and Big Pharma.

    They killed HSA’s … see, WE CAN’T BE ALLOWED TO KEEP A DIME.

    So with all due respect, folks, get off the USEFUL IDIOT “Taking Sides” and realize as Madison and Jefferson did: GOVERNMENT IS NEVER YOUR FRIEND. Tear it down before we’re Greece.

  • subframer

    “Of course, polls have also shown that Obamacare has become more popular over the past few weeks”

    yeah, positive polling now in the upper 30s. really impressive. see you in november, fat boy…. all the complicit media propaganda in the world won’t save this severely failed admin.

  • subframer

    lots of intelligence on this board. not. let’s see if i can find something smarter on E! or MTV…..

  • ThisIsNot4U2

    The TEABAGGERS will continue to FAIL as long as they keep “touting” IDIOTS like Ted “CRAZY” Cruz and Ted “YAHOO” Yoho.

  • yellinginthedessert

    Question to my republican friends
    Would you accept this compromise:

    Democrats get a tax increase on the top 2%, which we want because we want to invest (undoubtly you would say spend) more in infrastructure, research and education.

    And in return we do entitlement reform, increasing the age and income limits, which you want because they are a structural source of our budgettary inbalance.

    (If not, what kind of COMPROMISE are you willing to offer)

    • Jerry S.

      because we want to invest (undoubtly you would say spend) more in infrastructure, research and education.

      You mean $3 trillion a year is not enough? spend even more? How much is enough then?

      • yellinginthedessert

        Enough to have a modern and prosperous society, without wrecking our long-term fiscal stability (hence the proposed tax increase to offset the spending).

        So what do you say Jerry, Shall we trade tax increase tied to investment for entitlement cuts?

        • Jerry S.

          1. The Dems would never agree to cut entitlements.
          2. The GOP will say our taxes are to high already. And some might agree. See todays bloomberg report which tells the story of how England got back on top of the game: “London’s Low Taxes Lure Foreign Companies as Banks Retrench”.
          The article states:
          The U.K.’s base corporate rate is now 23 percent, down from 28 percent in 2010. By 2015, the rate will drop to about 20 percent, compared with about 29 percent in Germany and about 33 percent in France. The U.S. rate is 40 percent, though deductions mean few companies pay that amount.

          http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-10-17/london-luring-foreign-companies-with-low-taxes-as-banks-retrench.html

          Socialism, high taxes, does not work. If you’re not a student of history, you may ask François Hollande how stuff is working out for him…

          From an article in Foreign times this week:

          “François Hollande’s Socialist government is desperate to get across a message, not least to foreign investors, that France’s economy is in recovery mode and that it is now set to start reducing the heavy tax burden it has heaped on companies.

          This sunny prospect received a cold shower on Tuesday in the form of a survey of American businesses in France.

          Although respondents saw some improvement in economic conditions over the next two years after a worse-than-anticipated 2013, only 19 per cent expected to increase employment, while 26 per cent said they would be reducing jobs.

          More worrying for Mr Hollande, the survey showed a sharp slide in the perception of France as a good place to invest.”

          So what do you say: Shall we punish the “evil corporations” and raise their taxes even more? Perhaps we should engage in some more Crony capitalism and bailouts?

          Hey, It worked out so well! http://goo.gl/TCQTkD

          What do you say to this idea: How about we lay off all “Non-essential” federal workers?

          • yellinginthedessert

            Dems might very well agree to entitlement cuts (Obama has hinted as much), but the only way to sell it to our constituents is if we get something in return.

            We believe we need more investment in Education, Infrastructure and New Technology, and this must be payed for with a tax increase.

            You say this will hinder growth, but the relationship between taxes and growth is not as clear cut as you let on.

            I’d argue that stability, a good infrastructure and a well educated populace are just as important.

            And to be clear, I’m not proposing to go to European tax rates, just to increase them to, say, the Clinton rates.

            You’re base will not like that at all, just as mine will not like the entitlement cuts.

            But this is the nature of compromise, and it really is the only way forward.

            What’s more, if the tax increase really proves to be disastrous (which they won’t), you’ll have a stick to beat us with the next election.

            And so our republic moves, in fits and starts, but it moves.

          • Jerry S.

            I’d agree to Clinton tax rates, if you’d agree to Clinton spending levels…

            As for investment, we’re already investing our souls. But what do we get in return? What has the DOE got to show for all these years of “investments?” Americans today (children & adults) are dumber than the rest of the world!

            http://www.businessweek.com/ap/2013-10-08/us-adults-score-below-average-on-worldwide-test

            “Investment in Infrastructure?” Wasn’t that what the $850 billion stimulus was supposed to do? All those “Shovel Ready” jobs?

            “Investment in New Technology”? Don’t tell me, “Green Energy?” right?! Because Hundreds of Millions for Solyndra and other failed “green” & “Eagle killer” ventures weren’t enough?

            Please don’t take it personal. Blame Corruptocrat D.C. for my cynicism.

          • yellinginthedessert

            I think we’re getting somewhere. I think we can return to Clinton spending levels AS A PERCENTAGE OF GDP with the right entlitlement reforms and with the aknowledgement that this cannot be done overnight.

            Of course you’re right that simply throwing money at a problem will not solve it. I’m sure that discussing priorities and safeguards won’t be a deal breaker.

            Anyway, I’m still hopeful we can work out a solution. A lot of the vitriol and anger is just a result of this bad-ass recession we went through and all our politicians scrambling to blame each other.

          • Jerry S.

            “Anyway, I’m still hopeful we can work out a solution”…

            I fancy myself a social and fiscal conservative (or as Chuck Shumer would say, “Tea Party Extremist!”).
            I believe you’re a liberal. Still, I’m quite sure you and I could work out a perfect deal and fix our country’s problems much faster and better than our Reps in D.C.
            As long as we don’t “focus on the lobbyists, and the bloggers, and the talking heads on radio and the professional activists who profit from conflict.” http://goo.gl/1dMjFw

          • JohnG69

            I’d agree to Clinton tax rates, if you’d agree to Clinton spending levels… <– this x1000

          • JohnG69

            “You say this will hinder growth, but the relationship between taxes and growth is not as clear cut as you let on.”

            Completely false. The economy slowed down this year and the San Fran Fed said the majority of that slow down was due to increased taxes and VERY little of it was due to spending cuts.

            Simple concept: the more money the government sucks up the less money for the private sector and thus less growth.
            History:
            Kennedy cut taxes and growth accelerated
            Reagan cut taxes and growth accelerated
            Clinton cut taxes and growth accelerated
            Bush cut taxes and growth accelerated
            Obama raised taxes and growth and slowed down.

          • yellinginthedessert

            I’m sorry, but it really isn’t that simple.

            The relation between SHORT term growth and tax cuts is relatively well understood (just as the relation between government spending and short term growth). These are the so-called sugar rushes.

            Long term growth is a whole different ball game, however.

            Consider this, admittedly simplistic, example:

            It is 1999

            Country A has a tax rate of 25%, which provides its Government with just enough revenue to pay for basic services and maintain its current infrastructure.

            Country B has a tax rate of 30%. Besides maintaining its basic services and infrastructure, its government can also invest in Broadband Internet for all its cities.

            Which country do you think is better positioned for long term growth.

            Of course this requires SMART investment, not really the strong suit of our dear Reps in Washington, I’ll give you that.

        • JohnG69

          How much is enough??

    • JohnG69

      Spending is at ALL time high levels.

      Why do we need more??

      In the 90s we were spending less than 19% of our GDP today we are spending 22%. And it seems to me that the 90s were a lot better off than this past decade.

      You heard the saying “Don’t work harder, work smart.” ?? Perhaps we should apply that to our spending.

  • jagman1017

    Stu – SNAFU is not a word – it is an acronym. It stands for “Situation Normal All F***ed Up” – kinda like SCUBA or NSA or FBI or EPA or RINO. You should know this – you are a journalist – this journalism 101.

  • Marco64

    Republicans made a last-ditch effort to put the brakes on out-of-control deficit spending and to stop the ACA, which most Americans oppose. The Democrats dug in their heals to fund an unpopular program and to push the nation’s debt even higher. How did the Democrats win?

    • http://sustainablestate.blogspot.jp/ Chad Brick

      http://sustainablestate.blogspot.jp/2013/10/red-up-blue-all-way-down.html
      Republicans increase deficits, like clockwork. Democrats the reverse.
      Please explain.

      • HenryC

        Obama, by the end of his term will have increased the debt more than all other Presidents combined. I thought Bush and Regan were bad, but I had no clue as to just how bad Obama would be.

        • Nicholas DeLuca

          Better check your math !

          • Jerry S.

            So Obama didn’t add to the deficit in 5 years, more than GW Bush in 8 years?

          • chris

            The debt is a stock and the deficit is a flow. Obama did add more to the debt, because the deficits were so large in the aftermath of the financial crisis. However the deficit has fallen sharply the last couple of years, and is projected to keep doing so at least for the next few years. We won’t get to a surplus, so the debt continues to grow of course. But all we need to do is get the deficit low enough so that the debt grows more slowly than the economy.

          • Jerry S.

            “But all we need to do is get the deficit low enough so that the debt grows more slowly than the economy.”

            I agree. That’s “all we need to do.” One way to do that, is to Increase Federal employment and Entitlement programs…

            If you don’t agree, you’re are trying to “burn the whole house down” (Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz); “have lost their minds” (Sen. Harry Reid); are trying to negotiate “with a bomb strapped to their chest” (senior White House adviser Dan Pfeiffer); are “legislative arsonists” (Rep. Nancy Pelosi); and are engaging in “blatant extortion” (White House press secretary Jay Carney).

            Hey, it’s the tone of New civility!

            Back to your point: The deficit is indeed shrinking, comparative pace notwithstanding, but the nation’s incredible debt load is not. In fact, the Congressional Budget Office’s 2013 Long-Term Budget Outlook shows that the $16 trillion federal debt — already high by historical standards — will continue to grow even under some optimistic assumptions about future spending restraint. Already, the debt is 73 percent of the economy’s annual output, and CBO projects it expanding to an astounding, practically unfathomable 100 percent of GDP by 2038. The longer we wait, the harder it gets.

          • Prodius

            Obama has cut nothing. It’s a complete failure to not recognize Obama’s stimulus, $200 Billion to F&F, extra $35 billion to GM and Chrysler, along with clash for Clunkers on the 2009 budget.
            Once you realize this is Obama’s spending and not bush’s you will comprehend the damage done.
            Before a Congressional majority by Democrats starting in 2007 Bush’s prior 6 year deficit was only $1.9 Trillion, adjusted for inflation it was approx. the same as Clinton’s $1.7 trillion (Oh yes, Clinton ran a deficit).

          • Greg Smith

            You and I must live in different countries. You really believe that W’s F&F program had $200 billion spent? You really think we’d be better off without GM and Chrysler? That’s just silly….

          • progressivecurrent

            Fact: the majority of the debt incurred during Obama’s tenure was a result of Bush’s two wars, Bush’s tax giveaway to the wealthy, and Bush’s Great Recession.

          • JohnG69

            And his ‘fallen’ deficit is still higher than Bush’s deficit.

            Or did you forget that fact?

          • progressivecurrent

            “…the federal deficit has fallen faster over the past three years than it has in any such stretch since demobilization from World War II.”

            Read More At Investor’s Business Daily: http://news.investors.com/blogs-capital-hill/112012-634082-federal-deficit-falling-fastest-since-world-war-ii.htm#ixzz2i56xsSbD

          • JohnG69

            And it was still higher last year than any year under Bush.
            And it may still be higher this year than any year under Bush.

            Going from $1.4 trillion to $600 billion isn’t an accomplishment when the previous all time worst is $400 billion.

            Get back to me when he deficits become reasonable or even better yet when he balances the budget.

          • progressivecurrent

            In other words, Obama has done a much better job digging us out of the deficit hole, than Dubya did.

          • JohnG69

            His first year debt was triple the previous high.

            Now we are down to double the previous high.

            And you claim that is a good thing??

          • Jilli Brown

            There’s also the cost of those pesky bush wars – you know those wars were completely free until obama took office and he put them on the books. That’s another fine example of fiscal conservatism…just don’t account for the costs and they don’t exist. It’s like magic!

          • Nicholas DeLuca

            Like I said check your math. There is a difference between the annual deficit and the national debt.

          • progressivecurrent

            Fact: Bush’s two wars, Bush’s tax giveaway to the wealthy, and Bush’s Great Recession account for the vast majority of what was added to the debt during Obama’s tenure.

        • hepette

          your repuke/bagger friends just added 43 BILLION to the deficit with their ignorant ridiculous fiasco

          • fribble

            Your comment repudiates you.

          • ThisIsNot4U2

            Love your comment @hepette ;-)))))

          • Andres Bacalao

            Hepette:
            Sign up for a remedial English course and learn to use your words (Smiley Face just for you!). I do not refer to to the president as ‘OBambi’ or Nancy Pelosi as ‘the witch’. Once you learn something, you will stop projecting your ignorance on to others. Good luck!

          • Lame_Duck_Dems

            Shut Up, RACIST LIB-TARD!

          • PoliticalWireLiberalSite

            why is it majority of Obama voters receive foot stamps and welfare those leaches shouldnt even be allowed to vote

            Kick all illegals out they take up seats for us on NYC subways

          • http://mediajunkie.com/ xian

            you guys seem to be doing the foot stamps

          • Jilli Brown

            Ah…in reality (you remember reality, don’t ya’?) – red states are the biggest recipients of “foot” stamps. Look it up.

          • Lame_Duck_Dems

            Oh, you’re from NY “Sh—y’. Sorry for ya, bro.

            My advice would be to move South.

          • dectra

            Wow, Lameduck….what a well reasoned, thought out, cogent response…..

            People like you are why I and others left the GOP. To you, it’s a place to stoke hatred.

          • Lame_Duck_Dems

            Shut up, Lib-tard! You are as much a “conservative” as Chuck Schumer!

          • tpaine1

            Another Democrat myth. The ANNUAL federal budget is $3.5 TRILLION. We saved 43 billion in toliet paper while the federal government was shutdown.
            PS Obama is STILL down 8,ooo,ooo REAL American jobs since he took office. THAT should concern you not toliet paper.

          • dectra

            tpaine

            Glad to see you’re still here, albeit still posting b/s “facts” you gleaned from fox propaganda.

        • Immir

          I agree with the part about your having no clue

        • Lataya

          Um Henry, Obama only spent 1.4 Billion so far. A fact from Forbes! Do some research on plans and budgeting before you post a comment. It will help you in the future!

          Just incase you need a site to refer to, http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2012/05/24/who-is-the-smallest-government-spender-since-eisenhower-would-you-believe-its-barack-obama/

        • http://sustainablestate.blogspot.jp/ Chad Brick

          You can’t turn the Titanic on a dime. Bush ran up an incredible $1.1 trillion in debt in his final 180 days. It’s like you are blaming Obama for driving to slow on average when he started out with the car in the ditch and with two flat tires.

        • dectra

          Henry

          How much did the Debt go up as a result of Bush’s War of Choice in Iraq?

          Three Trillion Dollars.

          • 1mrt1

            Liar

      • Jerry S.

        Are you saying Obama didn’t add to the deficit in 5 years, more than GW Bush in 8 years?

        • Nicholas DeLuca

          The President can spend only the funds that are appropriated by the House. Thus, the increase in the national debt over the last five years was authorized by the House. You left that part out.

          • mabramso

            And the first half of that was controlled entirely by the President’s party.

          • Nicholas DeLuca

            My comment did not exclude the 2 years that the Dems. controlled the House. The point is that the President can only spend what is appropriated by the House regardless of who controls it.

          • Jerry S.

            You left out the part where the Dems had control of the house for half that time, and the part where the GOP fought against raising the debt ceiling, but had to compromise in the end because the Dems held a gun to their head (“Full faith and credit of the US depends on this”, as Obama always says…).

          • Nicholas DeLuca

            No. I said the House and did not specify only the 3 years the GOP/TP has controlled the House. The Democrat controlled House is included.

      • Marco64

        Your question doesn’t address the point I’m making about the current state of Washington politics. I’m not sure how the House Republicans came up losers when the majority of them were doing the job they were elected to perform. Your assertion that Republicans increase deficits is true, but it’s also true that Obama has increased the deficit to record levels and Democrats pushed–and won–for the opportunity to increase it even more.

        • Hickjustice

          I think you are mistaken about House of Representatives “doing the job they were elected to perform.” Recent polls indicated that 83% believe that the House is NOT doing its job. Worse, they cost approximately $24 billion in losses for nothing. They were doomed to lose from the outset.

          • Marco64

            You’ll have to give me the link to that poll. These are some interesting numbers too:

            Obama’s job approval: 44% approve, 51% disapprove.

            Obama’s foreign policy: 39% approve, 52% disapprove.

            Obama’s economy: 40% approve, 53% disapprove.

            Health Care Law: 38% approve, 49% disapprove.

            Direction of the country: 17% approve, 75% disapprove.

            Congressional job approval: 10% approval, 82% disapproval.

            Americans’ satisfaction with the way the U.S. is being governed: 18% approve, 81% disapprove (Gallup)

            It seems the Democrats should be concerned as well.

          • Immir

            Did you pull those numbers out of your a**?

          • progressivecurrent

            Link please.

          • Prodius

            The $24 billion is back pay to federal employees, something that would have happened regardless (that’s $9.88 billion per week for those furloughed workers). Those polls are general and do not ask who they favor more or less and include the Senate.

          • PrincePCIII

            The $24 billion is actually the amount of money it is projected the shutdown took out of the economy I n loss of GDP…has nothing to do with back pay to federal employees, most in fact will not be paid.

          • dectra

            Prod

            The 24 Billion is NOT all ‘back pay’.

            About $3.1 billion in lost government services, according to the research firm IHS.

            $152 million per day in lost travel spending, according to the U.S. Travel Association

            $76 million per day lost because of National Parks being shut down, according to the National Park Service

            $217 million per day in lost federal and contractor wages in the Washington D.C. metropolitan area alone

            So, Prod, when you post your thoughts, do us all a favor and check your facts FIRST.

          • JohnG69

            Think about it:
            40% of Republicans are unhappy that spending wasn’t cut
            40% of Democrats are unhappy that spending wasn’t increased

            Thus 80% of people are unhappy with congress, but for completely different things.

          • mabramso

            EXACTLY! This is why Congress is basically re-elected each year despite dismal generic approval ratings. The generic Congressional approval rating is the most worthless statistic in politics. It basically measures what people think about people they will never be able to vote for or against.

          • progressivecurrent

            {face palm} 40% of Republicans DO NOT represent 40% of Americans, nor do 40% of Democrats represent 40% of Americans, so combined they could not represent 80% of Americans. Don’t just “think about it,” instead just think.

          • JohnG69

            Irrelevant. A generic “are you happy with congress” poll is meaningless because it doesn’t ask WHY they are unhappy.

            Some people want less spending, some people want more, some want less government, some want less. When you pile them all together and claim ‘people are unhappy with government’ it ignores the fact that they are unhappy for completely different reasons.

            And more importantly in this context it ignores the fact that people who are unhappy with Republicans for not removing Obamacare or cutting spending are NOT going to switch over and vote for Democrats who want more spending and more Obamacare.

            So come November all these polls will be shown to have been meaningless.

      • rick550

        Congress is the party that controls spending. The opposite party of the president is usually in charge of congress. Case in point: clinton. He had to go through a government shut-down to be influenced into a balanced budget by Republicans. In fact they were VERY close to making an amendment. So your superficial analysis is just a form of bias.

      • Lataya
    • Gentil Aquitaine

      If they are right about the inevitable popularity of Obamacare, they have won. (Though, again, the whole Red State v. Blue State thing is a charade. Two center-right parties with a cartel on the ballot are running this country.) If they are wrong about it, they will be voted out by 2018. Either way, our corporate sector has its way with the country.

      • HenryC

        Popularity? Acceptance maybe. Planning your life around it probably, popularity is going the other way.

        • Gentil Aquitaine

          So far, the polls don’t bear that out. (You might think otherwise if you heed right-wing propaganda, but that’s to be expected.) The fact is, we don’t know how people are going to feel about it until after they have used it for a few years.

          • Jilli Brown

            Case in point – medicare.

          • Gentil Aquitaine

            It remains to be seen if it will be THAT popular. But the zeal of the Republicans to try and eliminate it NOW suggests to me that they think it just might be.

      • Marco64

        “Either way, our corporate sector has its way with the country.”

        …And pays billions in taxes.

        • Gentil Aquitaine

          What the corporations pay in taxes is peanuts compared to what they get from the country. They owe trillions.

          • Marco64

            HA! Hardly. Perhaps you should start paying your “fair share” too? I’m sure you can afford it. After all, some people have nothing…

          • Gentil Aquitaine

            Corporate profits have gone through the roof since 1980, while real wages have stagnated and poverty has returned. Income inequality is at levels that have not been seen since the late 19th Century (the present US Gini coefficient is a disgrace). We’ve overthrown sovereign nations and starved millions in the Third World for our multinationals. We’ve subsidized oil companies while cutting food stamp benefits and veterans benefits (and will soon cut Social Security and Medicare). We’ve given generous tax cuts to individuals and corporations who don’t give a flying f@#$ about the country or its people. We’ve let an elite, amoral and highly class conscious set of business interests fill the state houses, several Governor’s mansions and Congress with corporate puppets…

            And morons like you maintain we need to cut Corporate America slack…

            Breathtaking.

          • JohnG69

            Poverty has risen under Obama
            People on food stamps has risen under Obama
            Income inequality has risen under Obama

            Median income has DROPPED under Obama
            Workforce participation has DROPPED under Obama

            Every long term trend has gotten worse since Obama took office. That is not a good sign. And considering the fact that the recession ended in June 2009 only 5 months after taking office Obama really can’t claim to have ended the recession either.

            So what exactly has Obama accomplished?

          • Gentil Aquitaine

            If you think I’m prepared to defend Obama, you have misjudged me. He is as much a corporatist as was Bill Clinton–as much of a corporatist as Hillary is likely to be as President. The economic team he named in 2009 (Larry Summers, Tim Geither, etc.) was indicative of his economic philosophy. (Corporate profits vs. real wages are a reflection of his economics.) That said, next to Reagan and George W. Bush, Obama appears relatively competent.

            The economy of today is largely the legacy of trickle-down.

          • JohnG69

            Please…

            Compare Reagan to Obama on any economic indicator and get back to me.

          • Gentil Aquitaine

            Tax rates… lower under Obama (not that this has yielded a positive result.)
            Debt? In 1980, the United States was the world’s leading creditor; by 1987, it was the world’s leading debtor—this in spite of a decent economy. Obama… the trend is not much different, though Obama started with economy that in crisis.
            Real wages: virtually stagnant since 1980, no matter the president.
            Corporate profits: our corporate sector cashed in under Reagan, but have been swimming in wealth since Obama bailed out the corporate sector.

            Again, I’m not of a mind to defend Obama… he’s not less of a corporate shill than was Clinton, than were the Bushes, than was Reagan… but our adulation of Reagan is misplaced. It is more the result of propaganda than results.

      • Prodius

        Democrats are State Capitalists (see Cronyism/Fascism).
        No right wing party is centered around Cronyism, it’s anti-capitalist and free trade.
        State Capitalism is a fancy word made by 19th century economists (Keynes) to describe a lighter version of a planned economy (Communism).

        • Gentil Aquitaine

          “No right wing party is centered around Cronyism”…

          Were you alive during the Bush Administration?

    • Nicholas DeLuca

      Because they understood the consequences of a government shutdown and a debt default. They won because they are more more interested in governing than in political game playing and point scoring. They won because they are interested in our Country !

      • billbear1961

        Well said!

        Yes, Democrats stood up to terrorists who revealed the only thing they give a goddamn about is POWER–power they’ll do ANYTHING for, even threaten to unleash economic catastrophe on the country they pretend to love!

        They are utterly shameless GANGSTERS!

        But, finally, after what they just tried to do to us, the country is waking up to WHAT THEY ARE!

        • Prodius

          Hypocrite, the only person that could authorize a default on debt is if the President decided not to authorize it.

          • http://mediajunkie.com/ xian

            derp

      • Marco64

        If Democrats are more interested in our country, why do they continue to push for implementation of the ACA, which a majority of Americans oppose? Why did they push to raise the debt ceiling, when a majority of Americans oppose that as well? Lastly, if the Democrats are more interested in governing than in games, why did the administration place barricades around public monuments? The answer is obvious: The Democrats are more interested in gaining political capital than in doing the will of the people.

        • Ygorbla

          Actually, it’s only a minority of Americans who feel that ACA is going too far. The reason it doesn’t get overwhelming support is because there’s a significant number of people who don’t feel it goes far enough; but if you add up the people who don’t feel it goes far enough, and the people who support it as it is, there’s a majority who believes that ACA is a step in the right direction.

          It’s just that the people who are convinced that it’s going to murder their dog are louder.

          • Marco64

            Yeah, I keep hearing people make this argument, but regardless of intentions, polls show an overwhelming majority do not want the ACA implemented. People don’t like this program as it exists and they want it either repealed or fixed. Democrats in Congress aren’t listening. They are determined to push ahead regardless of the pain and inconvenience. They don’t care what Americans want. They only want what they want.

          • Ygorbla

            The Democrats have always been eager to improve it; the problem is that Republicans are generally unwilling to contemplate any changes short of stopping it in its tracks. When they do suggest an ‘improvement’, it is always something like “delay the entire thing for a year” or “remove the mandate” (which would, they know perfectly well, make the entire law unworkable because you can’t require insurance companies to insure people regardless of preexisting conditions without also having a mandate.)

            No Democrat would object to, for instance, adding a public option, which would be the most obvious way of improving it.

            In any case, you’re wrong about a majority not wanting it implemented. In any poll that allows improve / repeal / leave as is option, ‘repeal’ is in the minority, so Republicans — who are trying ceaselessly to repeal it — are the ones who are recklessly ignoring what the people want. The majority of the public does want ACA implemented and opposes the Republican efforts to defund it; they just want to iteratively improve it, which would be possible if the Republicans would drop their narrow and unpopular drive to destroy it.

          • Jilli Brown

            Marco, I’d suggest you leave your echo chamber for just a bit and listen to what folks really have to say about the ACA.

      • rick550

        Yeah, sure…they don’t even understand the consequences of 6% interest rates on our debt interest levels. That’s an interest in the future!? Just wait when this country hits 6% interest and we pay 800-1,000 billion on interest on the debt alone. Then the left-wing of the democratic party will fold. I don’t like the tactics of the tea-party, but you’re delusional!

      • Prodius

        We take in $220 billion a month, the payments are $30 billion.
        A default would rest squarely on President’s shoulders and the fact that Liberals don’t know that is a testament to their ignorance on the subject.

        • Nicholas DeLuca

          Speaking of ignorance, your is manifest. The numbers are right as far as they go but you neglected to take into account all the other monthly bills the govt. has to pay e.g. Social security, Veteran’s benefits, military salaries and benefits as well as paying for all the other services provided ton the govt.

        • Jilli Brown

          Prodius, that’s chucklehead economics. Do you enjoy being played for a fool?

    • Immir

      Republicans just cost the country 24 Billion, is this your example of deficit control?

    • Christopher Spuches

      Marco if you think the GOP won anything you are willingly blind. They lost, and everyone but Ted Cruz admits that.
      No one is disputing our debt problem needs to be addressed. But when you strap a bomb to the economy and scream repeal Obamacare or we’re gonna blow it up, you forfeit the right to be taken seriously. So the democrats win, maybe by default, because they look rational. Anyone looks rational after what the GOP just pulled.
      And what last ditch effort? The GOP controls one of three branches. How was the GOP ever going to win?

      • Marco64

        “No one is disputing our debt problem needs to be addressed.”

        Sure. The Democrats are. They’ve decided we need to plow ahead with the ACA come hell or high water. The ACA is the #1 reason true unemployment remains around 14-24%. It’s the single largest drag on the economy, preventing hiring and economic expansion. And you think the Republicans are responsible for trying to blow up the economy? That’s a good one.

        • dectra

          Marc

          The reason unemployment remains higher than it should be is simple: YOUR party ran on Jobs Jobs Jobs in 2010 and have not passed a single significant Jobs Bill.

          • 1mrt1

            You mean the Senate

        • Christopher Spuches

          96% of employers with over 50 employees already offer heath. Employers under 50 employees are not required to give health.
          The “ACA is the cause of unemployment” argument is unsupported and untrue.
          The GOP has been actively trying to suppress economic growth so that the Dems cannot take credit for it. The GOP has totally lost its mind since a man with darker skin that theirs came into office. Policies the GOP once championed are now called Marxist.

          If you didn’t notice, the House GOP wanted to default over ACA. Send the economy into a catastophic freefall, just so ACA would not be fully implemented. I wouldn’t trust these guys with lunch money.
          Sad, the GOP was once a great party.

    • Ygorbla

      Obamacare is actually relatively popular now (more popular than, say, the Republican party.) Only 38% feel that it’s going too far; 8% feel that it’s not going far enough.

      It represents a middle-of-the-road compromise; Republicans (and conservative talk-show-hosts) attacked it with insane fire-and-brimstone fury because they recognized that the fact that it was too moderate to get strong Democratic support would allow them to paint it however they wanted anyone on the other side getting enthused enough to defend it. But they overplayed their hand; most Democrats, at least, now agree that it’s at least a step in the right direction even if it’s too moderate for their tastes, while the conservative attacks on it have gone so batshit far from sanity that they’re no longer holding together.

      • Marco64

        Really? The ACA is a good program? It’s working? It’s good for Americans? Sooo…who’s batshit far from insanity?

        • Ygorbla

          Well, many of its provisions are only just going into effect; but yes, it’s a good program. It means that many people who would previously have no option if they lost their health insurance due to preexisting conditions (beyond “get sick and die” or “go broke, then get sick and die”) are now covered.

          I think it’s common sense that a system where a pre-existing condition makes it impossible for you to keep getting affordable healthcare is unworkable; and there are only a few ways of solving that issue.

          (Obviously I think that a public option or single payer is ideal, since that’s the only choice that’s really likely to rein in costs, but a mandate coupled with rules ensuring pre-existing conditions don’t increase your costs is at least a good compromise position — which is why, again, conservatives originally suggested it.)

          What’s your solution to the problem? I mean, it’s fine to say “that sucks”, but that’s because it’s trying to solve a problem that sucks — random, long-term illness that can ruin or endanger your health for your entire life — and any solution is going to involve some degree of pain.

        • Jilli Brown

          Marco, it looks like you’re the one “who’s batshit far from insanity”…

          – A Quinnipiac poll shows that 58% oppose Congress cutting off funding for the health care law to stop its implementation.

          – Kaiser’s tracking poll has consistently found strong opposition to scrapping the health care law. In late September, 56% disapproved of cutting off funding to the ACA.

          – CBS / NY Times pollsters found 56% of voters want Congress to uphold the law and make it work as well as possible, compared to just 38% who want to stop it by defunding it.

          – According to NBC/WSJ, only 39% support eliminating federal funding for the law while 50% oppose.

          – In Gallup’s recent polling, just 29% want the law repealed, while 64% want it kept as it is, or kept with some changes.

    • dectra

      Marc

      Give it a rest. Your side did this not to ‘control the deficit’. That’s only your “latest” excuse to deny 40 million people health care.

      The stated reasons the GOP shut down the government, from their own words:

      Defund the ACA
      Delay the ACA
      Delay the Individual Mandate
      Deny Health Coverage to Hill Staffers
      Deny Health Coverage to the President
      Deny Health Coverage to the Cabinet
      Deny Birth Control Coverage
      Build the Keystone Pipeline
      Change Federal Employee Pensions
      Expand Off Shore Drilling
      Block Net Neutrality
      Tort Reform
      Allow Coal Power Plants to Pollute
      Change the Tax Code to favor Businesses over Individuals
      Repeal the Medical Device Tax
      Change the Rules on the Debt Ceiling.

      Not ONE SINGLE demand on the debt…….until after your side LOST.

      So, Marc, where’s your rebuttal?

      • 1mrt1

        Allow Coal Power Plants to Pollute? You are insane.

        • dectra

          MrT.

          Nice of you to join the discussion. If you look at the GOP’s proposals, you will see they specifically asked that the EPA’s decisions regarding Coal plants to be rolled back.

          • 1mrt1

            And I agree 100%. There is no pollution problem with coal fired electric plants only the Barry promise to raise rates so high his pet green energy projects become more economical. All of your notions cost jobs

    • progressivecurrent

      Not sure where you are getting your “facts,” but multiple polls show that a clear majority of Americans support ACA and a super majority of Americans (both Dems and Republicans) support the individual provisions in ACA; it’s only when it’s polled as Obamacare does the balance shift to a near 50-50 split. In other words, you are demonstrably false in your assertion that a majority of Americans oppose ACA.

      You ask how the Democrats won over this Repub nonsense? You’re missing the larger picture: the shutdown likely turned Virginia from purple to blue for at least a generation, put the House in play for
      2014, sealed the VA governor’s race, and even has Mitch McConnell
      trailing in the polls now. As we know, Americans have short memory
      spans, which is why such a short turnaround time was set for the next
      standoff, because – with the exception of VA – voters may not hold this
      nonsense against Republicans in 2014. But, play out the scenario and
      you’ll realize there’s no upside for the Republican Party come the next
      standoff – especially when you take into account that it takes place so
      close to the mid-terms. If Republicans act like fools again they drive
      more voters towards Democrats in the mid-terms, which increases the
      likelihood of a takeover. If the Republicans act responsibly they turn
      off the T-Party or drive them to splinter into a 3rd Party, which are
      both great for Democrats in the mid-terms, because they increase the
      likelihood of a takeover. And, notice that nobody is seriously talking
      about Republicans having a shot of taking over the Senate after this
      failed coup d’etat.

      • Jilli Brown

        To pile onto the republican fiasco, look to the budget conference. Ryan is going to start pushing his crush social security and medicare plan, and that should just about eliminate any remaining republican voters – well, except family members and the hopelessly intellectually lazy. Old white people are the core of the republican base – now they’re prepping to chap them off. When you’re already losing the fastest growing demographics (youth, women and minorities) by huge margins, you really can’t afford to chap off the oldies, they’re about all the gop has left. But…stupid is as stupid does.

  • http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=PerryLogan Perry Logan

    The Repubs are simply returning the favor the Democrats did for them in 2008.

    In 2008, the Republicans were on their knees, broken and bleeding, their entire agenda in disarray. Americans were ready for ANY Democrat.

    After the election, Obama and his gang soon began resuscitating the hapless Republicans. The year 2010 brought an historic Republican victory–very much thanks to the Democrats’ performance for the preceding two years.

    By the time we got to 2012, it looked like the Republicans might even regain the White House–truly a tribute to Democratic ineptness. It took the worst candidate ever–Mitt Romney–and the help of Bill Clinton and Bruce Springsteen to put Obama over. (Shucks–I could become President if I had Bill Clinton and Bruce Springsteen campaigning for me.)

    We find ourselves in an odd situation: neither party is capable of doing
    anything the voters want. But, through their own ineptness, they are both fully capable of making the other party look good. In truth, people have been leaving both parties in droves ever since 2008.

    • Gentil Aquitaine

      Neither party does what we want… and yet they still have a duopoly on the ballot.

      “If voting made any difference they wouldn’t let us do it.”–Mark Twain

  • hrtshpdbox

    So I guess the Republicans have a “zero chance” of holding on to the House next year?

    http://rothenbergpoliticalreport.com/news/article/april-madness-can-gop-win-back-the-house-in-2010

  • Johnno66

    Most political experts agree there is very little chance that Republican house is in danger, and I seriously doubt the chances of a Republican Senate in 2014 have been diminished, so keep on ranting about damage. Most people I know are happy the Republicans made a principled stand to force recognition of the budget issues this president wants to deny.

    • Bob Anderson

      You won’t get a Republican Senate in 2014, and you might get a Democratic House in 2016. In any event, you continue to lose ground among independents while you right-wingers circle jerk each other.

      • Jefferson Madison

        A myopic view by a myopic mind. A mind that does not see the long game and probably has little understanding of American history. So just go study Reagan and see how he rose to power. Then you will understand just how wrong you are.

        • Atlas Shirked

          1) Jefferson and Madison would not giver you the time of day. You are an intellectual midget in comparison.

          2) Historical trends do not indicate future outcomes in wither the market or politics.

          Your point is moot.

      • Johnno66

        I wouldn’t call your post a circle jerk, but it was certainly a jerk fest. For instance, the use of your cyrstal ball failed to divine the fact even left wing prognosticators are calling the Senate up for grabs in 2014, but I’m sure you enjoyed the fantasy. Likewise, your prediction about the 2016 elections, more than three years away was equally fanciful.

        My advice: Don’t get any on you.

    • lostintheswamp

      most people you ”know” probably are happy about the very ‘principled’ stand the gop took ….. most people in the ‘country’ are not…

      • Jefferson Madison

        Until ObamaCare this them. You can’t make a statement like you just did and look halfway intelligent if you are ignoring the elephant in the room. Cruz and company are going to look like heroes when either A. ObamaCare pisses off a whole bunch of folks left and right or B. Obama delays the individual mandate (which it looks like he is thinking about now the fiscal fight is over).

        A year in politics is a loooong time. ObamaCare will still be here in a year and this stuff will be long forgotten. Nobody is going to care about hearing about fiscal brinkmanship when they are paying $1000/month for a married couple on the OCare exchanges. The message will be buried. The NRCC can’t keep up with the other organizations who are raising money to primary RINOs.

        Game it out. Look at the long haul. Look back at Reagan and study his rise to power. Everyone hated him as well if they were part of the political class. The people ended up moving from hating him to loving him. All it took was conviction and communicating conservative principles and not giving a damn about what people like you thought of them, because in the end, like it or not, you are going to see these people as your savior against the insanity that is DC.

      • Johnno66

        Most people in the country are completely ignorant. Most people i know are highly engaged (lets say activist) voters. Make no mistake. Republicans who took the “wrong” side on this issue WILL be primaried out of office and replaced with people willing to do the will of their constituents.

    • Ed Taylor

      You are correct that the shutdown affected very few voters. What is going to affect voters will be the sudden spike in out-of-pocket expenses related to premium & deductible hikes.
      Voters will continue to vote for their own pocketbook, and know which party to ‘thank’ for having less money when they go to the polls.

    • Atlas Shirked

      Congress has had 2 years to work on a budget. What happened to the House? Americans know what the extreme faction of the GOP is doing, and they know why it is being done.

      You say, “Most people in the country are completely ignorant”

      How many non-gerrymandered elections is your political ilk winning these days with that philosophy?

      • Johnno66

        Are you stalking me? You just replied to a 24 day old post. Get a life.

    • Paul Browne

      More delusional Vicar?

  • Bob Anderson

    Of course, the right wingers won’t believe the polls either. See some of the posts below if you don’t believe me.

    • Former Republican

      They have created a medical term for it called DPD (Delusional Poll Denial) It was thought to be eradicated in 2012 but apparently the disease still lives on . . . .

      • skylights

        They’ve been self-medicating through an experimental therapy called Unskewing, but alas, clinical trials have shown the therapy to be a complete failure that actually makes the problem worse.

      • Jilli Brown

        If you look at the big picture, polling is just a small fraction of their problems. Since obama’s first run, the right has been pushing a false narrative – creating a mythical version of Obama. The socialist/communist/kenyan/muslim blah, blah, blah. But they’re alternate reality is crumbling around their feet. Obama has won two elections – by pretty substantial margins. The last election night was classic – the con men were stunned, stunned I tell you that romney hadn’t won! Their phony narrative is only working on the bitterly delusional and the intellectually lazy. The majority obviously isn’t buying their schtick.

    • JohnG69

      The polls after the 96 shut down were as bad or worse and 4 years later Republican had complete control of the government.

      Our country has a very short memory. We will forget this shut down and how or why it happened. But the policy outcomes will not be forgotten and next fall that is what people will be voting for or against.

      • Jilli Brown

        I’m not so sure – things were different in 96. The internet and social media have a funny way of keeping action fresh in ones memory.

        • JohnG69

          Possible.

          But do you really think this shut down is going to change votes??

          People in red districts are going to all of a sudden vote for a Democrat over this?? Or Democrats in California are going to vote for a Republican?? Nah… doubt it.

  • Steve Rodriguez

    Obama negotiated in 2011 yet he didn’t this time. The notion that the public will remember what just happened in the next week or so is a joke. The Republicans tactically and strategically made errors, but every Congressional district will be driven by local issues or hatred of Obamacare. Now, we return to discussions of Middle East incompetence, or the Obamacare disaster, or foreign policy failures, or a stalled second term agenda. I registered (tried) and after multiple error messages, the taking of my SS#, more error messages, I reach the end, press submit – have to start over, and my login doesn’t work.

    Anyways, you get the drift. Had these idiots known the art of politics, the Repubs could have gotten red state Dems squirming by passing clear CR and debt ceiling increase, with some riders delaying the medical device tax and prohibiting the Congress and the executive from getting a sweet deal to avoid the harsh negative effects of Obamacare. I am a tea partier, but the defund or nothing crowd are idiots. We lost at the ballot in 06 and 08. The Supreme Court confirmed the law is Constitutional (as a tax, and in a convoluted way, but they ruled that way nonetheless). For us to REPEAL Obamacare requires winning both the House and the Senate, and overrriding a veto, OR, winning the House and the Presidency and forcing the Senators in conservative states to swing our way. Absent that, Obamacare is law. Bend over and grab your knees.

  • danram

    The big losers in the long run will be the Tea Party whack jobs on the far right. Many moderate Republicans like me are sick & tired of their BS and this was/is the last straw. I just looked up my local congressman, who is a Republican, and saw that he voted against last night’s budget resolution. As a result, I will no be voting against him in November 2014.

    • Jefferson Madison

      Sorry, but the NRSC is not raising money right now, even given the recent events. But the Heritage Foundation, Club for Growth, Freedomworks, the Senate Conservative Fund – all are raising money at alarming rates to oust the RINOs. Why? Because the Tea Party is engaged and willing to dig deep to save this country. The establishment types tend to me more apathetic and disconnected. Sure, you may get all whipped up now, but come next year nothing is going to happen and the NRCC is still going to be begging for money to protect their precious RINOs.

      ObamaCare is going to take the eye off the fiscal issues and when it does people like Cruz – who fought to save the people from this disaster – are going to look like heroes. Like Reagan, you are going to be surprised at how fast Cruz’s popularity explodes while RINOs like McCain are roasted in a primary.

      • Jilli Brown

        Oh, I get it…up is down, black is white and anarchists are patriots trying to save the country. Got it.

    • tinderbox1 .

      What part of $86 trillion of present value unfunded liabilities for social security and medicare added on to about $3-4 trillion for Obamacare and an out of control military budget do so-called “moderates” like you not understand? Please take a basic course in economics or at least learn what present value, inflation, interest rates and real v. nominal GDP mean. It is, with all due respect, people like yourself that are to blame for the country running a fake economy fueled by never ending debt and monetary stimulus. You are cut from the same cloth as the consensus middle of the roaders like Heath, Rockefeller and Ford that have brough stagnation, poverty and decline to many a western economy. Get real, wake up, and understand that the time for compromise is long past. The adults, far from your incoherent rant, are actually those few Republicans (and maybe one or two Democrats) with the courage to say enough is enough with the debt, spending and never ending foreign commitments.

      • hepette

        It’s perverse to weaken our nation’s first line of defense against hunger and poverty by $4 billion per year while giving hundreds of billions to big corporations that don’t need them. Here are a few examples of what your hard-earned tax dollars are spent on:
        $7 billion per year subsidizing the oil industry.
        $600 billion—15 times the value of proposed food stamp cuts—over a decade by allowing corporations to stash cash overseas.
        $1 trillion over a decade be allowing special tax exemptions and loopholes for multinational corporations and wealthy households.
        $137 billion over a decade by not negotiating prescription drug prices.
        Over $20 billion per year on farm subsidies.
        It’s not rational or right, but this is who they are. Conservatives aren’t being fiscally responsible; their policies are destructive to our economy.

        • sentry1

          Don’t know about the oil industry subsidy, but if you’re right, I with you agree on that.

          As for food stamps…aren’t they part of t he same farm subsidies you decry?

          I’m all for exemptions. Wish I had some.

          And as for drug costs…that’s Obama’s baby. He just got you insurance, he didn’t put controls on drug costs or any health treatement. Try Canada.

          • Jilli Brown

            No, food stamps are not the same as useless ag subsidies – paying millionaire “farmers” – many of them congressmen – for nothing. Food stamps are money immediately going right back into the economy.

        • JohnG69

          Clueless…

          The $600 billion stashed overseas is money earned overseas. We couldn’t get that back if we tried. Pass a law to claim that $600 billion and watch how fast companies turn their overseas holdings into independent companies.

          And apparently you don’t understand the concept of multi-national. If GM makes $1 billion in China they can leave that money in China if they want and not pay US corporate taxes on it. But if the US government says they want to tax it why would GM just hand it over?? Wouldn’t it make more sense for them to start a company call GM China that has NOTHING to do with the US owned company and then not pay that tax??

          Also, if all of these things are bad then how come Obama isn’t trying to cut any of them?? Ever hear Obama talk about cutting farm subsidies? Did he push for negotiating prescription drug prices??

          • hepette

            pls provide FACTUAL proof of your statements…..they are not true.he definitely pushed for negotiating drug prices as part of the aca. you are ignorant evidently.

          • JohnG69

            He pushed for negotiating on prices but it is not included in the bill?? Why not?? Which Democrat blocked it?

            And if you don’t understand how corporations make money over seas then I certainly am not going to spend the time trying to explain it to you. Start simple and ask yourself how it got overseas in the first place because they can’t make it in the US and then sneak it out without paying taxes. Which means it was earned over seas.

            Read this for starters

            http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/01/31/us-usa-tax-territorial-system-idUSBRE90U1FC20130131

      • Former Republican

        You have to be suspect of a political party that is obsessed with passing along ‘debt’ to our children but have no problem passing along a polluted planet, stripped of its fossil fuels and saddled with a poor population without access to healthcare . . . .

        • Jilli Brown

          Exactly – what difference will debt and deficit make when you can’t breathe the air or drink the water.

      • Paul Browne

        The rot was hugely accelerated by Bush’s tax cuts to his friends, supporter’s corporations and financial backers, like the Kochs and Waltons. They have made billions and it has been paid for by stripping the middle class and the poorest in society.

        Tax cuts combined with Bush’s deregulation of the Financial system, inevitably caused the world banking meltdown. This again made the richest richer and the poorest poorer.

        Thankfully, President Obama is getting the US back on the right course and bringing the country out of the nightmare of the Bush Depression. Just today, with the $13 billion fine on J P Morgan. some of the corruption is at last been brought to book. Well done President Obama. It’s a pity Bush and Cheney could not also be brought to justice.

        • Jefferson Madison

          Someone is off their meds. Love the revisionist history. You come up with that all by yourself?

          • Paul Browne

            Now that Cheney is admitting he lied about WMD, things are becoming a lot clearer. It will be interesting to see if he can be charged with war crimes. We will have to wait and see if Bush or his dad have the guts to admit they were corrupt as well.

    • demmi

      You were not voting FOR him anyhow. Phony loser.

    • JohnG69

      So you plan on voting for a Democrat next fall??

  • sentry1

    Wellllll now….I beg to differ.

    Republicans may have lost this battle (which I think they knew in their hearts they would lose all along) but I believe they have made some great advances in the war against government overreach. Thanks to the shennanigans of Cruz, et al, the bright light of media shined on democrat excesses day after day.

    The cost for a “shut down” federal government to put up barricades around a war monument and post guards? Maybe a few thousand dollars. News footage of grizzled old warriors moving barriers out of the way and bravely pushing past those guards? Priceless.

    • Gentil Aquitaine

      Larry Klayman as Joseph Goebbels… The dude waving the Confederate Flag in front of the White House… I’d say something like ‘true colors’ were shown. What it means is anyone’s guess

      • sentry1

        Why all the fascination about one guy carrying a flag?

        • Gentil Aquitaine

          The Confederate Flag to some in this country—perhaps the Obamas—is equivalent to the Swastika. The hate speech of Klayman was close enough to the antisemitic rhetoric of the Third Reich that those attending that rally (and put up with what he said) should be ashamed of themselves.

          What I found really disturbing about the imagery from the rally, however was the look in the eyes of the guy with red shirt (waving the flag). You catch that same look from images and footage of the Sturmabteilung of the Weimar Republic.

          Stopping him would not be my priority—educating him might be.

  • rene591

    let the purges begin. republican civil war. to be filmed by Ken Burns. confederates vs union. tea party vs establishment. rubble in the jungle. debacle of epic portions

    its going to be great

    • Gentil Aquitaine

      It provides more serious, old school Republicans like Jeb Bush with a window of opportunity. I don’t expect the GOP will allow the 2016 primary field to be a clown-car as it was in 2012.

  • jb potts

    The Tea Party that I support has 3 principles-
    Fiscal Responsibility, Constitutionally Limited Government and Free Markets.

    The shutdown tactics were ill-conceived, however, the principles remain intact.
    If these are radical, extremist, evil ideas, then I am living in the wrong country.
    I support lawful, civil tactics to create prosperity for all Americans, regardless of race, class, income, sex, etc.

    Am I a Republican ? Today, I’m not sure. I would like our Government to run smooth, debts paid, and budgets balanced. I am not for name-calling or partisan vitriol.
    I am tempted to throw in the towel , quit my job, live off entitlements, and join the liberal utopian society.
    Hey brother, can you spare a dime ? The Government was suppose to care of me.

    Lol — I remind myself, that George W. and company (Washington, not Bush) lost most of the skirmishes with the Brits, but eventually prevailed to create the greatest country in the world.
    No- Liberals are not the ole Brits , just fellow citizens with different ideas regarding policy.

    JB

    • Gentil Aquitaine

      News Flash: Free markets are the modern economists unicorn (they don’t and can’t exist in a capitalist system); the Constitution was written in a pre-capitalist era and, thus, lacks many of the controls needed to keep the American Capitalist Enterprise from subverting democracy; fiscal conservatives are tilting at windmills as long as the the American electoral system remains fundamentally corrupt.

      • jb_potts

        Capitalism has it’s flaws, but it is still the greatest wealth and freedom engine in the world.

        “The great virtue of a free market system is that it does not care what color people are; it does not care what their religion is; it only cares whether they can produce something you want to buy. It is the most effective system we have discovered to enable people who hate one another to deal with one another and help one another.”
        ― Milton Friedman

        • Gentil Aquitaine

          Uncle Milty, the Chicago Boys, and their version of Scientology: Free Market Worship…

          Another false God we don’t need.

      • jb_potts

        I support anti-trust laws , reasonable regulations, and controls to keep our products safe- who wouldn’t ? But please, don’t tell me how much soda I can drink, or how much bacon I can eat !
        Advice – sure…give me the facts, and let me decide.

        How did that anti-free market work out for the Soviet Union – on the 5 year plans, Government regulating supply and demand? And free speech, free assembly, etc, etc.

        Windmills—lol — I thought liberals were into that wind power, except, not in their backyards !

        • Gentil Aquitaine

          American liberals conservatives alike are fond of bringing up the failure of the Soviet Union as though their and our social systems are dialectical opposites and the ONLY available alternatives. This is a classic application of the fallacy of the excluded middle. The fact is, the Soviet experiment was merely an extreme variation on the very social system we employ. (The system the Chinese employ is another such variation.) It was a corporatocracy… a radical monopoly (one the likes of which the Brothers Koch would sacrifice the whole world to achieve). We like to think that with a few canny regulations and some social safety nets we can keep such a radical monopoly from reaching our shores, from tainting our capitalism (the Keynesian pipe-dream). But truth be told, the tendency of internal actors to radically usurp political and economic power IS the essence of capitalism, whether practiced by us, the Brits, the Russians or the Chinese. Capitalism—like any social system founded on competition and the institutions of money and property (public or private)—is ultimately incompatible with democracy.

          American liberals and conservatives alike harbor fantasies of a saving grace… social justice / getting money out of politics (as a be all end all) is one, the mythical free market is another.

  • Stephen Vincent

    This article is right in one regard, the GOP brand as it is currently was damaged. The truth is that brand needs to change. McConnell got $3 billion in earmarks, let’s call it a payoff, for Kentucky. Might as well have been 30 pieces of silver. Boehner did like he always does, back down to the Senate, he couldn’t lead a kindergarten class. Think about this, how many of us were really affected by the government shutdown? Not really that many. And if you think raising the debt ceiling is a good idea, go out and get yourself maxed out on credit and try to get another card… it’s basically the same thing. I grow more disallusioned with what America is becoming each day. If you want to look at the moral compass of the parties it’s simple, democrats believe in killing unborn children and saving the lives of criminals, Republicans believe in killing criminals and saving the lives of unborn children. Republicans believe in taking responsibility for their own actions (controlling your debt, saving the unborn, and punishing criminals) and the current democrats believe in you are not responsible for your own actions.

    • Gentil Aquitaine

      The current democrats (and republicans) believe members of the corporate sector are not accountable for their actions. The rest of us… pfft. We are fodder for the ever burgeoning corrections industry.

      World Incarceration Rates (per 100K):

      1
      United States
      716

      2
      Seychelles
      709

      3
      Saint Kitts and Nevis
      701

      4
      U.S. Virgin Islands
      539

      5
      Cuba
      510

      6
      Rwanda
      492

      7
      Anguilla
      487

      8
      Russia
      484

      9
      British Virgin Islands
      460 c.

      10
      El Salvador
      425

      11
      Bermuda
      417

      12
      Azerbaijan
      413

      13
      Belize
      407

      14
      Grenada
      402

      15
      Panama
      401

      16
      Antigua and Barbuda
      395

      17
      Cayman Islands
      382

      18
      Thailand
      381

      19
      Barbados
      377

      20
      Saint Vincent and the Grenadines
      376

  • Älter und weiser

    This is bull.
    The Republicans have no spine, but they do have several votes where democrats refused to fund government programs that the public wanted.
    The only error the republicans made is not flooding the house with such votes.
    The Cspan videos will be good campaign material

    • Former Republican

      The only people those stunts impressed were the same Tea Party dimwits that follow Cruz and YoHo . . . .

      • Älter und weiser

        As opposed to the dimwits who voted for Obama.

  • The Bob

    Cruz is done as a presidential candidate.

    • driverlesstaxi

      Done as the nominee, likely picks up a few wins as presidential candidate

      • critten

        In an increasingly shrinking GOP, he will, IMO, in fact be the nominee in 2016, the climax to the Pickett’s Charge of the GOP on reality. It will be preceeded by big defections of moderate GOP law makers who now realize they have no future in today’s GOP, to the Democratic Party, which will re-establish a conservative wing and become what it once was sans the racists. Christie, Kelly Ayotte, even Marco Rubio simply haven’t figured out they are Democrats now.

    • ThisIsNot4U2

      You say that as if he ever had a chance….

    • Jefferson Madison

      Nope. They said the same thing about Reagan. Everyone, and I mean everyone hated him. Him and Cruz are on the same trajectory and both can communicate to the people very, very well. He is just getting started.

      • Former Republican

        No doubt he will run but after this stunt he is now the new Herman ’999′ Caine of the GOP . . . .

      • critten

        Everyone hated him? You are so full of shtttt I doubt you even lived during his time, as I did. Reagan’s greatest asset was always his charm, no matter what party you belonged to, only the real fringes “hated” him. That’s why he was a winner, and that sniveling little fascist is a Cruz to No Where.

        • Jefferson Madison

          Yes, I was there and you are a wrong is every aspect. He was loved by nobody and ostracized by the establishment and the media, as well as the liberals. You sir, are outright lying. I doubt you lived during those time. I WAS his charm that won over the people who at first were not very enamored of him due to the fact he was being attacked by all sides. That is what ticked the establishment off the most – the fact the people did not listen to them. When ObamaCare hammers millions next year, it will be Cruz whom they remember was the one who stood up and fought while the the RINOs ran with their tales stuck between their legs. Mark my words. President Cruz it will be. The man is not dumb. He was the youngest lawyer to argue a case in front of the Supreme Court. He is far smarter than you or I.

      • ThisIsNot4U2

        Yes…But Reagan wasn’t CANADIAN!

        • Jefferson Madison

          I heard it said we sprang from apes. Obviously you did not spring far enough.

          • ThisIsNot4U2

            Says the knuckle-dragging teabagger.

          • Jefferson Madison

            Wow, what a complete lack of wit. Your parents must be proud. Is that them calling to you telling you dinner is ready and to wash your hands before coming to din din? What time do they tuck you into bed?

          • Atlas Shirked

            You simply cannot hid your brownshirt community from the press. The “intellectual”, half-baked Libertarian elite to which you seem to ascribe yourself cannot hide them … just too many.

  • Jefferson Madison

    To those who defend Democrats and RINOs. Give me one good reason why
    they should be exempt from a law you and I must follow? Do you honestly
    believe they are better than you? Next time you look in the mirror ask
    yourself this: “Am I more able of taking care of myself and making my own decisions or does the government know what is better for me than I do?”. “Am I some dolt who is unworthy of the same treatment and perks as those who rule over me, as opposed to ruling on my behalf, which is what they should do?”. The answer will tell you a lot about yourself.

    This is so easy it’s amazing that pundits don’t realize it. Look back at Reagan. Look at who demonized him. Some pretty big conservative names on Sunday talk shows today did not have anything good to say about the man back in the day, but they all love him now. He was hated by the left, and by the rank-and-file GOP, but at the end of the day, when polled, Americans are more conservative than they think and when someone comes out and articulates those principles well, they win.

    Ted Cruz forced front and center a debate that has never reached such a fever pitch before. When Obama does delay the individual mandate (which he will and very soon), then Ted Cruz is going to look like a genius and McCain, McConnell, Boehner, and other RINOs like the sellouts they are. The Establishment GOP brand is dead, it’s just nobody sees it yet. The re-branding of the GOP to real conservatives who follow up words with action is going to happen. Prepare for Reagan part two.

    Nobody thought Reagan stood a chance and everybody was against him. Then the people heard him talk. It was game over. A myopic overview of what just happened is easy to promulgate. The real pundits, when they take the long view, are starting to see something happening. The establishment, tied to the 24 news cycle, has no skillset in taking the long view. Hence they will be the ones who look like idiots at the end of the day. Regan was a long view person. So it Cruz. They know how to read the Tea leaves and, more importantly, don’t give a damn what others think about them. That wins hearts and minds. With the roll-out of ObamaCare, two things can happen. Obama lets it continue on its disastrous path and every RINO who did not fight to defund will be primaried by really pissed off voters, or Obama delays the individual mandate (already whisperings of that) and everyone realizes this is what Cruz wanted as a backup to full defunding. The result – primaries to RINOs. So yes, the GOP RINO brand is damaged. The clock is ticking on K-street and corporate driven RINO half-wits who believe the people are too stupid to catch on to their game. It’s time they get a wake up call.

    • cometboy

      It makes my skin crawl that you think you can even associate yourself with great men like Madison and Jefferson. They would scrape you off their shoes.

      • Jefferson Madison

        You did not even answer the question did you. I wonder why? Your retort means nothing as it was Jefferson and Madison who would have applauded the Tea Party of today. Hell, Jefferson as one of the authors of the Kentucky resolutions, penned about a concept called Nullification, whereby the states just ignore the federal government. It was also Jefferson who right pointed out that the Supreme Court never had the right of Judicial Review and only gave themselves that right in the Marshall Court in Marbury vs. Madison. He would have looked at the recent ruling of the Supreme Court about ObamaCare and said “who cares?”. The SCOTUS does not have the right under the constitution to make the decision it did. So no, they would not wipe me off their shoes. They would, however, flush you down the toilet.

  • 633

    The GOP will hold the House by any reasonable evaluation, but perhaps sacrifice some pickups that might have been possible: same result per the Gingrich era. Senate races are so individualized/state specific that generalizations on party branding are largely irrelevant.(Although a very close race-see Arkansas-may be tipped.) Bigger issue: a GOP national electoral strategy in Presidential years is now held hostage to what amounts to an effort at a hostile takeover within the party, led by the radio babblers (churning their ratings) and a small far right contingent buttressed by large dollar (see Heritage) political interests that really are completely predicated on ideology, and don’t care about winning.That’s bad for the country, because effective opposition is necessary to correct the special interest indulgences that characterize the Democrats “I pledge allegiance to” the government indulgences.

  • ThisIsNot4U2

    You don’t see Dems infighting with some IDIOTIC splinter group. The Repugs were dumb enough to get mixed up with the TP and now THEY’RE getting teabagged.

    • SonofaGip

      That’s because the entire democrat party is an idiotic splinter group. Spend, spend, spend…

      • ThisIsNot4U2

        And all your party manages to do is waste America’s time with your INCESSANT infighting. Time for the Tea(bagger) Party to disband.

  • HopyMcChange

    In a few months, when everyone is complaining about Obamacare, Republicans will point to this as the time they tried to stop it.

  • HenryC

    I doubt seriously if it will change a single House seat. It might have some effect on the Senate, but the ACA roll out will, in the long run, have significantly more effect as it will continue. As it is going to cause dramatic increases in costs in most states I think the Republicans can rest easy.

    • cornerofthemoon

      Uh huh and Romney will win the 2012 election decisively.

  • WhatMightBe

    ObamaCare will implode all by itself.

    The GOP can just stand aside and shout “We told you so”..

    Here is why it will die and unlike Social Security be repealed in 2014 or 2016 by the GOP:

    1) Website does not work

    2) Premiums cost 30% to 300% more than before ObamaCare

    3) Deductibles are a minimum of $5,000

    4) Hospitals now screen for ObamaCare patients and demand pre-payment for the deductible since they know the ObamaCare patient won’t pay later

    5) The $95 fine in 2014 will be used by tens of millions of Americans and put ObamaCare trillions in debt just in 2014

    6) The average Liberal will finally realize that ObamaCare is not free

    So I hope the GOP just steps aside and watch ObamaCare die a slow and painful death……………

    • manapp99

      And they have lost Ezra Klein as one of it’s cheerleaders.

    • cometboy

      I agree that the federal exchange web site is buggy, but it has to account for 26 different sets of regulations because 26 different Republican governors refused to set their own exchange up…in effect ceding control of their health care to the feds. The state exchanges have had problems too, but have generally worked well.

      As for premiums, you’re frankly out of your mind. Every state has shown an average premium DROP under the ACA. Sure, the policies have gone up for the youngest, but most of them were not opting for full coverage plans. I’m sure your local ‘news’ source found you a costly plan with a $5000 deductible, and you didn’t decide to check on your own. They have to feed the sheep doncha know.

      One of the great joys of the next two years for me will be to watch you and your ilk fret over the public’s realization that the ACA is working fairly well in places where your party didn’t sabotage it. Better will be your confused shock when people become angry that your pathetic, politically motivated tantrum has both made getting insurance harder for the citizens of the states you control and has cost the lives of the poor, sick, and elderly who can’t qualify for Medicare in states where you wouldn’t even take *free* money to cover them.

      Yeah, you just keep going with your plan. I definitely like it.

      • manapp99

        ‘One of the great joys of the next two years for me will be to watch you and your ilk fret over the public’s realization that the ACA is working fairly well in places where your party didn’t sabotage it.”

        Unless of course it doesn’t. Then what?

    • jeffwarren2

      High Deductibles are the CONSERVATIVE IDEA. If you don’t like VERY HIGH DEDUCTIBLES, you’re not a CONSERVATIVE. They bash ObamaCare for having a CAP(EVIL REGULATION) ON DEDUCTIBLES instead of allowing $10K+ deductibles for individuals and 20K+ deductibles for families with unlimited HSA contributions. This what Consumer-Driven healthcare is all about.

    • critten

      You don’t want them to have any health insurance at all, why are you complaining about deductibles? And it is not just 95 bucks, it is either that or 1% of your income, whatever is higher, and it is going to be paid by those who need the least amount of health care, and when multiplied out it will create a multi-billion dollar fund to pay hospitals indigent care. What do you offer as an alternative? Nothing. Zip. Buttkiss.

      • Unclelou

        Cretan,
        You’re glad I’m not in one of your classes Prof. Low-watt. You seem to have the same math challenge of the uninformed, liber-uber-alles.
        It will take 10,000,000 (that’s ten million for the comma challenged) @ $95 per PAYER to reach 95% of one of your billion bucks COLLECTED, in the bank…errr…US treasury. Typically, less than 1% of what’s COLLECTED reaches its destination, hospitals in your several-fries-short-of-happiness fRactoid and your Nothing. Zip. Buttkiss is the amount that will be written on the checks to the now bankrupt 1,000′s of hospitals.
        Mr. Math-flunked-that-class-again-darn-it, The Republican version of Obamacare was 100 pages. The Democrats added 1900 pages of graft, cronyism, exemptions and fees…err taxes.
        Now if you would like a lesson on your Bush tax credit criticism…let’s go!
        Sorry if I had to lower my communication comprehension level so you and your handlers could follow. You did didn’t you? I also left out a whole bunch of expletives you use to bump your word count to your providers.

        • Atlas Shirked

          How about buying one less 10 000 000 000 USD F-35 to help with that? Left out the commas for you.

          • Unclelou

            Proved my point. With that many USDs you could buy a new aircraft carrier, outfit it with 20 F-35s and drive it around for a couple of years. Unless you include the liberal, Democrats’ corruption and cronyism. Then I guess you’re right; you will only have enough for one F-35. Way to go demonstrating math skills and comma counting!!!

        • Paul Browne

          *cretin

  • Mittymo

    The Dems presented Republicans with a Solomon’s choice. But rather than sacrificing the life of the baby, Republicans gave in.

    But if you re-read the story of Solomon & the baby, you’ll see that the Dems were the ones willing to sacrifice the baby for their pyrrhic victory.

    While some may think those that gave in lost, the people of American may see it differently. They may see that the Dems (like petulant children) were willing to sacrifice America in order to get their way.

    The Dems promised the Republicans they would negotiate in good faith if they caved in. Now, let’s see if the Dems keep their promise, or not.

  • manapp99

    The Dems won and the American people lost. The debt continues it’s upward march unabated. Thanks Harry, Nancy and President Obama.

    • critten

      The debt started it’s unabated march under Bush, after Clinton handed him a balanced budget, and much of what is marching around in the debt is thanks to his phony “tax cuts” and other give aways to the rich, not to mention the trillion dollar check he handed his banking buddies on his way out the door. Most common voters realize that, you right wing nut jobs live in a fantasy world where Obama is the big black bogey man to be blamed for it all.

      • manapp99

        The debt climbed under Clinton as well. Did you know that? People think a balanced budget meant we did not borrow but that is not true. Look it up. As far as the march goes it started way before either Bush or Reagan or Carter of Ford……Get the drift. The debt is a product of both major parties. The GOP is no better. The status quo is the issue. That is why we should embrace third (and more) party movements. LIbertarian, green, TEA whatever. Got to break the monopoly the two parties hold.

      • Curmudgeon52

        Clinton got balanced budgets once Rebulicans took over Congress. Not before that. Thanks, Newt.

      • Jilli Brown

        C’mon now…it’s all obama and the democrats fault. Those two bush wars, the medicare drug plan and the double-dip tax cuts were all free until a democrat won the presidency. It’s all free – it didn’t cost a dime! Now all the bills go back on budget. Everything’s free under republican presidents – they don’t have to pay for anything (credit Orin Hatch for that bit of reality) – the bills only come due when a democrat is in the white house.

  • WhatMightBe

    Remember the good ol’ days when Pedro could drag his family to the ER and get free and unlimited world-class healthcare?

    Starting on Jan 1, 2014 that will change forever.

    Now Pedro will have to get an ObamaCare healthcare plan before the hospital treats his family.

    Pedro will have to buy a policy from HealthCare dot Gov and since Pedro can’t speak English someone must help him.

    Somehow he pays the $95 fine and then the hospital wants up to $5,000 in cash , his deductible, BEFORE Pedro marches his family back to a treatment room. Pedro is a freeloader and the hospital won’t get any money from ObamaCare until they are paid that $5,000 by Pedro.

    So Pedro goes from getting free healthcare to $5,000 ObamaCare.

    Ha ha ha ha ha..

    Revenge is sweet……………

    (P.S. I’m sure it’s a Federal crime to treat Pedro without ObamaCare….)

    • cometboy

      Your obnoxious xenophobic rant aside, you clearly don’t understand anything about the law. The ACA does not repeal the requirement that emergency rooms treat those who come in, regardless of if they are insured.

      So, you’ll still be paying for ‘Pedro’ when he shows up for care after he is injured on a job you’d rather be unemployed than be bothered to do. Get out your wallet!

      Oh. And can I yet again thank you and most of the posters on this thread for continuing to demonstrate that you are exactly the sort of people we on the left say you are? I mean, *we* knew it all along, but it helps convince the middle to have you folks shouting it out like you do. Keep up the good work!

      • WhatMightBe

        ObamaCare changes everything.

        No more free ER treatment – Pedro must have ObamaCare to be treated.

        That’s the whole idea behind it – to do away with free ER visits…

    • critten

      Pedro will pay the 95$ fine through income tax withholding. All those fines, paid by people who need the least amount of healthcare, go into a fund to reimburse all those ER’s for whatever Pedro does, it’s called “insurance”.

      It would help you if you simply read like, the Wiki or something on the Affordable Care Act instead of talking out of your lower orifice.

  • tinderbox1 .

    The outcome would have been different if the Republicans called Obama’s and Reid’s bluff by saying, shock, the truth, which is that default was never on the table and would be impossible without Obama issuing an executive order to not pay the interest on the debt. The Treasury takes in about $250 billion in tax revenue every month and the interest on the debt, at current artificially low rates, is $20 billion or so. Thus, there was never any issue as far as “paying our bills”. The facts that Republicans bought into this and succumed to media pressure is unfortunate.

    • SonofaGip

      In the end, the establishment republicans caved to Wall Street, which doesn’t care that the government keeps spending recklessly.

      • critten

        ^ light bulb going off in head of Republican.

    • critten

      it just doesn’t work that way. Of course, the bond holders would have to be paid first, in order to protect our very ability to sell bonds. But sooner or later, in the list of appropriations made by Congress over decades, that comes due that month, you are going to get to the ones at the bottom who cannot be paid. Since you wish the bondholders to be paid first, it will be Medicare, Social Security and Defense that will get the short end of the stick. Your theory seems to miss this fact, that it will be those who will be defaulted on. If that is what you want, you want your own political destruction.

      • Ted Nolan

        I have to live within the income I have, so should the government.

      • 1pakajam1

        Medicare & Social security are two of the major bond holders. Check it out please.

  • ounceoflogic

    We all know now that Republicans are not what they say they are. We no longer have a two-party system. The Republocrat ‘party’ of cowards (greedy cowards) exists only to be blamed by the progressive party. America is done.

    • critten

      What may be closer to the truth is that you have become too radical for the GOP. Millions of Republicans are starting to see that.

      • CicerosGhost

        Hmmm… The Republicans perpetually concede to the wishes of the Dems and the progressive Dems policies are enacted…

        Right track/wrong track…?

        13%

        Believe that their own member of congress should be re-elected?

        25%

        Believe that the federal government can be trusted with the responsibility for national security?

        68%

        Believe that they can be trusted with ANYTHING ELSE?

        38%

        Amnesty?

        62% say NO…

        Health care is an exclusively personal responsibility?
        (No role for the federal government)

        62%

        Is a perspective more proximate to truth emerging yet?

      • ounceoflogic

        I’m too radical? For believing we should spend within our means? for wanting to protect our borders? for wanting to take a long look at o’bamacare before we turn over control of 16% of our economy to Sebellius? for expecting our president to respect the Constitution? for wanting our country to be whole again? If that makes me a radical then put me at the top of the list.

        “Millions of Republicans” see no such thing. The Republicrat party may not have moved… but they have certainly been unmasked in the past several weeks. Just because you ProgressiveRINO’s and your friends who actually admit to being progressives call people like me extremists doesn’t make it true.

        • Atlas Shirked

          The Tealiban never get to the “spend within our means” point. This is because most of them live in bright red states that take more federal money than their citizenry pays in income taxes.

          The Tealiban’s states are Big Government… they would starve.

          • ounceoflogic

            “Tea”liban… that is so creative.
            I assume the Tea Party states you refer to are New York, California, states like that?

        • Paul Browne

          The ACA is the law. Get over it.

          • ounceoflogic

            Jim Crow was also once the law. Did your gang fight to overturn Jim Crow laws? Oh wait… bad example. How about the Abolishment of Slavery….you fought… no… sorry… um… I know… the Right To Vote… you Dems pushed hard for that… ah… sorry… no Dems voted for it… my mistake… OK I got one you guys did support… Abortion… Roe v Wade…

  • BobbyPFalcon

    Reading the posts of PINO’s – Patriots In Name Only – it’s hard to imagine them agreeing with anything that goes against their worldview. A Patriot doesn’t take pride in obstructing the majority. A Patriot doesn’t do willful damage to our country. A Patriot doesn’t pretend he won when he actually lost. The last people that should be calling themselves Patriots are Cruz and his followers. He put himself over country and party. The GOP’s reward? Record-low poll numbers.

    • Curmudgeon52

      If you had been alive in 1776 you would have been one of the royalist that wanted to stay under British rule. The PATRIOTS that seceded from England were a distinct minority (20-30 percent depending on the source). Our government was devised so that the majority could not overrun the minority. Often in the past the minority has stood against the will of the majority it is the most American of positions. Like a Doctor removing a limb to save a patients life, or setting a backfire against a forest fire, sometimes you must do small damage to prevent larger damage. Ted Cruz and other Patriots stood against the most damaging legislation to ever escape Washington. As for poll numbers, even after all this the Republicans are still far ahead on the generic congressional ballot.

      “If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.”
      ― Samuel Adams

    • CicerosGhost

      Did the ACA ever poll above 50%?

      No?

      Then WHO is disregarding ‘the majority’?

      • Jilli Brown

        It appears that you, in your grandiose sophism is the one “disregarding ‘the majority.’ The majority clearly doesn’t want the law repealed…here’s a little factual reality for you –

        – A Quinnipiac poll shows that 58% oppose Congress cutting off funding for the health care law to stop its implementation.

        – Kaiser’s tracking poll has consistently found strong opposition to scrapping the health care law. In late September, 56% disapproved of cutting off funding to the ACA.

        – CBS / NY Times pollsters found 56% of voters want Congress to uphold the law and make it work as well as possible, compared to just 38% who want to stop it by defunding it.

        – According to NBC/WSJ, only 39% support eliminating federal funding for the law while 50% oppose.

        – In Gallup’s recent polling, just 29% want the law repealed, while 64% want it kept as it is, or kept with some changes.

        It appears that the majority is willing to see how the law plays out – that’s what the tp’s fear the most. We’ve seen this all before – medicare implementation was really similar – now try to pry medicare from the republican bases hands. Go ahead…

        • CicerosGhost

          Tactics poll poorly but how do you suppose that THAT represents support FOR the ACA itself?

          Defunding is a tactic…

          As for the ACA support?

          http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/obama_and_democrats_health_care_plan-1130.html

          lol…

          Critical thinking is hard but you should try it out sometime…

          Good luck…

        • David Baur

          According to the WP:

          “The actual support for the law, as written, was just 43 percent. But a more recent CNN poll, conducted in September, found that support had dropped to 39 percent. That’s 20 percentage points lower than what Reid claimed.”

          Kieser Permenante shows:

          “Public opinion on the ACA as a whole continues to tilt negative this month, with 37 percent saying they have a favorable view of the law and 42 percent expressing an unfavorable view, shares that have held relatively steady since February of this year.”

          The most commonly chosen reason for opposition to defunding the ACA is that “using the budget process to stop a law is not the way our government should work,” (named as a major reason by 69 percent in this group), followed by a belief that “without funding the law will be crippled and won’t work as planned,” (56 percent) and feeling that the law will be “a good thing for the country” (49 percent). Fewer (35 percent) say their main reason for opposing defunding efforts is that they’ve “heard enough about the health care law and it’s time to move on to something else.”

          To quote Polls one has to remember, if they are from Media sources, they are usually tainted to one view or the other. So your Poll results don’t mean squat except to Sheeple. I just like asking real people, and so far, this law is junk, and nobody I have spoken with wants it.

          • Paul Browne

            You keep feeding yourself that lie, and the GOP will “win” the mid-terms, just like Mittens “won” the Presidency. Lol.

    • sjm_1

      Why should someone agree with something that goes against your ‘worldview’(i.e. principles). Leadership isn’t just following polls; it’s changing people’s minds.

    • David Baur

      Except the GOP’s roll is higher than the Democrats right now, and the presidents lower than any…so keep talking you lies…or are you just ignorant of facts?

      • Paul Browne

        Is your name Baur or Baaaa? Because, you’re the sheeple. Lmao!

  • Defend Liberty

    Since morality underpins liberty, we should remember that taking advantage of liberty’s opportunities obligates us to deal with resulting consequences.

  • ConstanceUnderfoot

    Democrats are trying to measure Political Damage.

    Conservatives are trying to help Americans avoid Real Damage.

    The first will be fleeting, the latter indelible.

    • Jilli Brown

      So constance, how does needlessly blowing more than $24 billion in economic output just to keep millions from getting access to affordable health care “help Americans avoid Real Damage?” Please proceed…

      • billbear1961

        And how does threatening the economic LIFE of the country with catastrophe, if your extortion demands aren’t met, demonstrate your love of country?

        I’d like to hear these ruthless psychos answer THAT.

        Their behaviour proves all they care about is POWER–power at ANY PRICE.

        This isn’t the behaviour of a patriot. It is the behaviour of a TERRORIST.

        One does not threaten the LIFE of that which one loves.

        To paraphrase a line I heard once in a film, they “love” this nation like a glutton loves his lunch.

        EDIT: Jilli, you might like to sign this petition. I hope you will!

        http://petitions.moveon.org/sign/arrest-and-try-house.fb40?source=s.icn.fb&r_by=2499077

        There are more of a like nature at whitehouse.gov/petition.

        These fascist animals must be DEALT WITH.

        • David Baur

          You don’t know much about the Law or what Congress’s job is do you? You have been so played. Sheeple drive me crazy.

          • billbear1961

            I know that it is their JOB to keep government open and operating.

            I know it is their constitutional DUTY to defend the validity of the U.S. public debt.

            I know that to use the threat of default and the economic CATASTROPHE that this would
            provoke to extort changes in the law of the land is SEDITION.

            I know that the behaviour of the GOP in this matter is an UNPRECEDENTED act of BETRAYAL
            of their own country by a major American political party.

            I know that, with this action, the GOP have revealed that their ONLY concern or interest—their ONLY motivation—is the pursuit of POWER—power at ANY PRICE.

            I know that one does not threaten to MURDER that which one loves!!

          • Paul Browne

            He knows a lot more than you! Lol!

            The House can not refuse funding for mandatory programs. The ACA is the Law of the US, it is not part of the appropriations budget. I know you will not agree, but it is the truth, but then you know that, don’t you?

  • Ted Nolan

    Recall every traitor RINO scumbag no matter the cost, no matter the sacrifice.

  • fred789

    The Republican party is much stronger now and no matter what they do in the next year, it will be overshadowed by the disaster known as Odumbocare. You need to get out of Washington once in while because what your lame polls and consultants call “damage”…………..Mr. Average Joe calls progress…..

  • Karen

    Lindsay Graham will lose his primary, the other RINOs will survive.

  • sjm_1

    I don’t see how this worked out all that bad for the GOP. The big losers appear to be the moderate Republicans. Ted Cruz has never been more popular with the base. The Democrats and the President showed themselves to be intransigent and petty. The GOP reaffirmed in no uncertain terms their opposition to the ACA, just as it’s imploding.
    The negatives mentioned in this column will fade quickly; the positives will accrue to the benefit of the GOP for a long time. Call me skeptical of the ‘expertise’ of the ‘inside the beltway’ experts. I am more inspired to support and contributed to the GOP than anytime since Ronald Reagan ran in 1980.

    • JohnG69

      Don’t forget that the Republicans got more out of this than the Democrats.

      The Democrats got a delay for 4 months.
      The GOP locked in sequester spending, a change on the policy about Obamacare subsidies, and an agreement to form a committee to cut spending even more.

      Liberals should stop looking at the polls taken today and instead look at the policy outcomes for tomorrow.

    • Jilli Brown

      Ah…sjm, it’s going to take a whole heck of a lot more than the republican base to win national elections. Have you taken a gander at the polling of independents? I suggest you do. The republicans are already losing the fastest growing demographics – youth, women and minorities – by astounding margins – this stunt didn’t help them one bit. Yeah, Ted polished his creds, at the detriment of his party. That’s a win?

      • sjm_1

        Ah…Jilli, Brown, leadership is not just pandering to people by telling them what they want to hear. Leadership is defining a direction and getting people to follow you. Ted Cruz grabbed a national spotlight and spoke for hours on conservative values and principles.
        I’m not interested in getting power just for the sake of enriching Republican cronies and insiders instead of Democratic cronies and insiders. I’m not interested in just slowing down the liberal agenda as they lead us down the road to dependency and poverty. I want someone who is going to change direction! Who want’s to lead us back to freedom from an overbearing massive government. I don’t care that ‘the fasted growing demographics’ of people who are too uninformed to understand and too apathetic to vote aren’t on board yet.
        Later on when the youth grow up, the women get married and have children and the minorities become the majority they can thank us that we saved their country for them.

        • Jilli Brown

          Ah…sjm, something tells me that you WILL care about the fastest growing demographics when it comes to national elections. You freedom loving change agents will never win national elections. Ted Cruz’s favorability is dropping like a rock as is that of the tea party – they are sadly out of synch with the majority, and they don’t even realize it because the echo chamber they/you reside in aren’t presenting reality.

          • Paul Browne

            sjm_1 will, as you said, care about the fastest growing demographics of the liberals, but he is a prime example of the Tea Party’s delusional mentality. Whist Cruz gets ever more popular with the most extremist right wingers, as to being electable, he is already dead in the water.

            He will never be in a position of power, because even the mainstream republicans are desperate to rid themselves of him.
            It will become much more evident when the Tea Party get slaughtered in the mid-terms.

  • JadedFan

    For a pollster and journalist you are pretty blind to seeing what is in front of your face. At least you are not as clueless as the democratic hack Cook, but you are close.

    The shutdown, much like everything else in the country today, is seen through two prisms by the two halves of this country.

    Republicans have fallen in the polls, true, but unlike the mid-90′s shutdown, democrats and Obama are only slightly better.

    So what do the polls mean?

    National polling means nothing, if 100% of NYC and SF hate republicans it means almost nothing. Check the polls where the action is in 2014, red states, and the shutdown at best is a draw but more likely HURTS DEMOCRATS in states like in West Virginia, Arkansas, Alaska and North Carolina.

    Anyone with half a brain could see clearly that there is a very polarized viewing of what went on. Republicans, as the party out of power, are having an internal debate more about strategy than goals, which they are unified in. Much like the democrats had with the Dean wing of their party which now dominates their party. SO OF COURSE REPUBLICAN POLLING IS LOWER, given that debate. That it is only slightly lower speaks volumes.

    Any national polling on this issue, especially so soon after, is meaningless. Check the individual state polls and maybe for once you will speak as if you had a clue.

    • Guest Speaker

      Jaded Fan: Your observations are astute. I would also offer the following which Messr Rothenblog fails to address. Firstly, there are 6 major domains of elected government of which the GOP controls 4 and that includes the House and all major areas of state government. Also, this administration has lost 71% of all SCOTUS cases, and that represents 2.5x the historic average for Presidents. No poll can reconcile the 14$ million in debt carried by the DNC, and polls can not be used to re-organize state Democratic parties in states like AR, NC, LA and AK.
      The MSM is but a force multiplier for this administration which permits it to masquerade weakness as strength. The sooner the GOP appreciates this communications ploy, the sooner it can capitalize on the true political landscape of the country.

  • gommygoomy

    Time will tell, Mr. Hack. (What is it with American Jews? One of Obama’s Best Buddies is LOUIS FARRAKHAN, for God sakes)

    The Republicans, if nothing else, have put everyonebutOBAMAcare on the front burner.

    When the IDIOTS start realizing how much the un”Affordable” Care Act is gonna actually COST THEM?

    Let’s just say: There will be a Reckoning.

    I promise you.

    • Former Republican

      And what happens if you are wrong? Will you Repent?

  • jackcarlson

    disagree completely. This debacle served to separate the wheat from the chaff. Now we know who the traitors are in the Republican Party. They cannot hide anymore….

    • JadedFan

      These purity tests really need to stop.

      If the vast majority of the right to life movement, all of whom would want to see abortions in most cases end, can focus on winnable battles like late term abortions as an incremental approach, and can differentiate between organizing for pro life causes and getting a gun and shooting an abortion doctor, maybe tea party types can recognize that all republicans have the same goals, but focusing on things that actually accomplish those goals instead of the stupidity we saw here and in putting forth morons like Aiken might be a smarter way to actually get to sane fiscal policies.

      All that I know is that the strategy of Cruz and his followers did not accomplish much, except lose leverage in pushing for the very things he claims that he wants.

      There are much smarter ways to get from A to B and a circular firing squad which SETS REPUBLICANS BACK from getting there is the stupid way to go about it. The party has the same goals, especially fiscally, it is time we united and found SMART ways to get as far toward those goals as a divided country will allow. The Democrats have done that despite the Dean wing of their party dominating them, it is long since time we got to be as smart as they have been.

      • Beth

        Tea Party needs to step away from the GOP. We haven’t had any luck with the country club Republicans, and they haven’t done any heavy lifting in the last six years.

        No use dropping a bucket down an empty well…

        • Jefferson Madison

          No need to. ObamaCare is going boost the Tea Party caucus and what for primaries to oust the establishment traitors. The GOP will becomes the party it is supposed to be – conservative and strong. You can take this to the bank – all this talk now is not going to mean squat as more and more people realize what ObamaCare is doing to them. That is going to take stage front and center. Liberals don’t realize it yet, but their own base is about to turn on them like never before. Nothing like messing with someone’s livelihood, job, and pocketbook to finally get them to see the light. Living in Austin, I love hearing the recent graduates now labeling their professors at college as a bunch of half-wit hacks. They now know they were sold a bill of goods by a tenured ideological dolt who never worked a day in his life. The tide is turning. 2014 is going to be a good year.

    • Former Republican

      Once you catch those no good RINOs I think you should personally force them to join the Democrats. That will teach them . . . .

  • Bobby Bateman

    I think Politico needs to send some of its reporters to live outside of the Beltway. I live in SF and even here people are getting tired of: a) this ultra partisan rhetoric, and b) deficit spending and growing debt. These toned scribbles probably play well at an upscale DC restaurant, or to the omega-males that refresh Politico 20 times a day, but tend to fall upon deaf ears to ordinary people.

  • Cameiros

    Hey y’all.
    David Duke here.
    How about that Ted Cruz?
    What a guy.
    I’m sending him my favorite confederate battle flag…the one my granpappy flew over our house every day.
    In fact, I’m enrolling him in our local Klan chapter.
    You say he’s not one of us?
    Well now, that may be but I have a way ’round that.
    In my official capacity as Grand Drago…oops, make that ex-Grand Dragon,
    I’m hereby making ole Teddy Cruz an honorary Aryan.
    Thats right – one of nature’s best.
    And I want all my great Tea Party buddies to attend the ceremony.
    Stay strong people, and remember…
    Jesus is Lord.

  • mistermcfrugal

    Look, if the only way you can avoid “damage” is to do what the far left wants, then it’s better to take whatever “damage” you gotta take.

  • SandMan00

    Ted Cruz would not be the factor he is if it were not for the current deficit of leadership in the GOP. He merely stepped in to fill the vaccum created by those who should have led, but did not. If the Establishment GOP had made any effort to meet grassroots conservatives halfway by supporting more conservative candidates and policies, instead of declaring a scorched earth internecine war against them, then we would not have seen the parade of
    not-ready-for-prime-time primary candidates attempting to fulfill that role. It is a fact of political reality that neither the Establishment nor grassroots can win without the other, but the party elites seem not to recognize that they have more to lose than the grassroots, who do not believe they have anything to lose from a party that refuses to grant them the legitiamacy they deserve. The fact that the Democratic Party supports the GOP elitists in their fight against the grassroots should be seen as an indicator of whom the Democrats consider the bigger threat to their interests however.

  • jackleeeen

    not really … i just laugh POINT BLANK at anyone’s insurance premiums skyrockering because of obamacare … they deserve what they voted for

  • Sam Lane

    Obama, Dems and RINO’s stood united and won! We get to borrow and spend “more” money that we don’t have! Yahoo! We are the winners of 17 Trillion in national debt and climbing! In your face crazy Tea Party! Disaster averted. Slaves to “more” borrowed money, more taxes for you and me! Lockstep bigotry with no logic or reason prevails! Down with the Tea Party! Comrades…..

    • AshMat

      you really don’t get it do you? the debt ceiling is to pay for debt ALREADY INCURRED!
      I completely agree we need to reduce spending going forward, but defaulting on our debt really does nothing to help that situation, in fact, a default would have resulted in the cost of debt going up and it becoming that much harder to pay off our debt.
      We on the center left empathise with your focus on the debt, but we think you are completely bonkers in the way you want to go about making govt reduce spending.
      Cut Medicare, Medicaid and Military spending slowly over a 10 year period so that you don’t shock the economy into another recession, let the private sector slowly pick up the slack, and put small tax increases in place to assist on the revenue side. That’s how responsible debt reduction is done. The slash and burn method is completely irresponsible and just crazy if you know anything about economics.

  • JohnG69

    the Damage Is Undeniable which is why Booker won by 9 points less than Menendez did last year…

    In fact Booker had the worst performance by a Democrat in a dozen years…

    • gommygoomy

      That’s because Menendez carried 100% of the 14 Year Old Hooker vote.

  • WhatMightBe

    Heritage Foundation just reported on ObamaCare:

    36 states implemented ObamaCare exchanges -

    only 5 show decreases
    30 show massive increases averaging around 50% increase in premiums

    Wait until January 1, 2014 when you get to pay a lot more for what you already have……

    • JohnG69

      You mean wait until the enrollment numbers start to come in and we find out that people are not signing up rather than paying for over prices healthcare.

      Insurance for me would be $200 a month for the cheapest plan. That is a car payment or more than I pay for electric, gas and water each month.
      I’d be stupid to sign up for and pay for insurance at that price.

      BTW I have insurance from my employer so don’t flame me for not being responsible etc etc.

    • cmb

      You didn’t provide a link so I don’t know whether you’re accurately representing the Heritage Foundation’s report.

      The facts are that 17 states setup their own exchanges; 7 states entered a partnership with HHS; and 27 states refused to cooperate so HHS created and operates their exchanges.


      State Decisions For Creating Health Insurance Marketplaces

      The rest of your claims are baldly ludicrous.

      • David Baur

        No they aren’t.

  • Gary L. Sudeth

    Is this a moderated comment page or are all-comers welcome? For Roll Call the invective and personal attack level on this page seems rather high.

  • pauls

    This will be a vicotry for dems only if ACA becomes a success…if its a failure and americans grow to dislike it more then the repubs will be the ones that tried to prevent a disaster…way too early to tell how this shakes out in the end

    • califconserv

      Media will not allow that to occur. Plenty of excuses will be made and it will be said that it should have been expected all we need do is work it out.
      Where was the media to point out the hypocrisy of the democrats in allowing politics to trump doing the right thing for the middle class? Corporations given a break but people not? The politics was so important that democrats were allowed to choose closing the government and threaten everyone with disaster. So there is no way it’s going to be reported as anything but growing pains.

      • pauls

        true

      • AshMat

        How can the media override people’s personal experiences with Obamacare? if it sinks or rises in popularity, its because people are having a good experience with it, or people are not.
        Get over your obsession with the media for everything, sometimes the American people can make up their own mind.

        • amphiox

          It is ironic how they complain about the media, when they have an entire major network dedicated to promoting right wing propaganda and nothing else, and every other major network save for one leans right of centre, and that one exception tilts only slightly left of centre.

          • califconserv

            Major network NBC/MSNBC.
            The vast majority of people get their information from the majors.

          • David Baur

            I don’t. Fox news actually beats them all, but then again, Fox is only one against the others. It is too easy to see these Television stations being owned and controlled by Democrats, and Fox news is only slightly better and only in reporting more facts, outside of that, they are horrible as well.

          • Paul Browne

            ” Fox news is only slightly better and only in reporting more facts….”

            Hilarious!! Fox News isn’t a News programme. Didn’t you know that?

  • Native_New_Yorker

    This country is so screwed thanks to Obama, the DemocRATS and RINOs. We are bankrupt, now burdened with an unexecutable health care system; over taxed and have lost all of our Freedoms and Rights as guaranteed by the Constitution; and now will be overrun by 11 million ILLEGAL CRIMINALS offered free healthcare, housing, food, voting rights and eduation!!!! That is more than we American tax payers receive.
    Welcome to Obama’s vision of America: The United Socialist States of America.

    • odypoly

      Two unfunded wars, Medicare Part D, tax cuts for the wealthy — that’s what the GOP gave us after eight years at various levels of government control. You may wish to forget, but we will not let you.

      • sentry1

        The gift that keeps on giving…we’re STILL letting kids get killed in Afghanistan. Great job following up on campaign promises.

      • David Baur

        Funny, that has been going on even more since Barry got put in office…So what is your point?

    • Sam Parry

      Gotta be a joke, right. Please tell me you’re kidding. Please, please don’t let anyone really be this stupid.

      If you’re kidding, I can play along. We’re so screwed. Damn that Obama for personally letting all those millions of illegals into the U.S. and for trying to ban Christmas and for his personal hatred of country music. I bet Obama spends his entire July 4th bending down and praying on one of those carpet thingies to Allah. God, what a terrorist. If only we hadn’t allowed any non-white-males to vote ever — yeah, that’s the America I believe in.

      If you’re not kidding, please know I am. All of this is nonsense. Nasty hate-filled emotions grounded in nothing more than pure right wing fantasy.

      • sentry1

        Well…give us a clue…just how stupid ARE you? And how hate-filled?

        • Sam Parry

          I try not to hate. Try mostly to laugh. I thought the original comment might be a joke. Have we “lost all our Freedoms and Rights?” Really? Are we really “overrun by 11 million ILLEGAL CRIMINALS?” Do we really offer these “ILLEGAL CRIMINALS” more benefits than tax payers receive? These are not serious statements.

          I believe in balanced budgets, which by definition means you levy enough taxes to pay for the programs we have. There are three drivers of budget deficits in the U.S. — Defense spending, Medicare/Medicaid, and Social Security. Everything else we spend money on is chump change and represents only about 15% of our federal budget, with much of that going to things like veterans benefits and the Justice Department.

          If we want to spend $1 trillion per year on defense and homeland security, well, you need to tax enough to pay for it.

          I agree we have long-term Medicare/Medicaid budget problems. But, those problems are not limited to Medicare/Medicaid. They are problems with the entire health industry — there is too much waste in the system overall. The Medicare/Medicaid budget deficits are symptoms of a much broader problem that even if we completely eliminated Medicare/Medicaid would still exist and would still cost Americans trillions of dollars. So, to gripe about Medicare/Medicaid deficits misses the point. You’re going to be paying for soaring health care costs one way or another, and if you want to complain about something, that’s the root of the problem.

          Social Security is an easy fix. Raise the cap on payroll taxes, do a bit of means-testing, maybe raise retirement age a year. Done. I’d cut that deal right now.

  • AshMat

    Could republicans and the right wing please get their debt and deficit talking points based in facts before blathering on about them?
    The facts are that both the debt AND the deficit is largely influenced by policies that were in place before Obama was elected. I’m by no means defending Obama’s presidency, I think he’s been a middling president, though has probably had to deal with more than his fair share of crises, both domestic and international.
    HOWEVER, the debt and deficit are largely driven by three items, Medicare, Medicaid and the military. Nothing else really matters, honestly. None of these things will get touched by either party, and in fact Republicans will not touch 2 of these three with a 10 foot pole, and in fact want to increase military spending. In addition to this, just before Obama was elected, the revenue side of the deficit fell through the floor. The response was a mix of both spending and tax cuts to prop up a collapsing private sector (remember that 1/3 of the stimulus was tax cuts?)
    SO while Obama has in fact been responsible for adding amounts to the deficit, most of it was already baked in by previous adminstrations. Obama’s probelm was that he couldn’t start cutting the deficit while the economy was in the doldrums. He certainly could have done more to grow the economy, including rationalizing the tax code, cutting red tape, etc, but largely we would still be trillions more in the hole than we were 5 years ago even with a republican president.

    • David Baur

      I would re-look at the numbers now.

  • Greg Smith

    In answer to the last question. One can only hope so…

  • tpaine1

    Well, Sean Trende disagrees. Pew disagrees so Stu, who other than the Beltway crowd, agrees with YOU??

  • ErikDC

    The Republican spin on the Affordable Care Act is all lies. I purchase my health insurance as an individual. I finally looked at my state’s exchange today and I can get the exact same plan I currently have with Kaiser Permanente now for $50 less per month through the exchange — same co-pays, deductible, prescription drug costs, etc.

    Am I going to do it? Well, duh. I get to stay with Kaiser and it’s $50 less per month.

    • sentry1

      And a big thank you goes out to the Obama spin team for that excellent example of using social media to market a bad product.

      • ErikDC

        I’m a real person and speak only for myself. No one paid me to write that, but was certain someone would write something negative after I did.

        Do I care? No. I’m not going to argue with you. You can go ahead and think it’s a “bad product.” It’s the exact same product I buy now, just from a different store, for a cheaper price.

  • dectra

    To Ted Cruz, The Canadian Senator:

    In the words of Nelson Muntz, “ha ha”

  • Greg Gutlessfeld

    It doesn’t matter in the states you mentioned. In KY, MS and KS the candidate with the R next to his name automatically wins.

  • Alexis

    And to Stu Rothenberg goes the Predictable Leftist Journal Prize.
    It is as though Rothenberg wears his brain backwards. Absolutely everything he has said here, is diametrically opposite what is logical pertaining to the facts of the topics he rants about..
    Mr. Rothenberg, you are suffering from the Eric Cantor syndrome.

    Ted Cruz, haa the wind at his back! There is no possibility NOW, precisely because of what he and Lee have done, that the Democrats will even come close to taking back the House ’14. They have ‘won’ their long-term goal.
    You’ve no idea of how much respect and ‘pure hope’ they have generated in the public’s psyche – beyond the arch Conservatives – that has an energy momentum that will boggle your mind further in the coming 3 years.

    The Cantor Syndrome;

    The House feted Boehner with an ovation – and Eric Cantor took the podium to lace it with more poison;

    “Everyone in this room ran on the Republican ticket,” Cantor told colleagues.

    “We all agree Obamacare is an abomination. We all agree taxes are too high. We all agree spending is too high. We all agree Washington is getting in the way of job growth. We all agree we have a real debt crisis that will cripple future generations. We all agree on these fundamental conservative principles. . . . We must not confuse tactics with principles. The differences between us are dwarfed by the differences we have with the Democratic party, and we can do more for the American people united,” he told them.”

    This is a replay of a scene from “Guys and Dolls” – a room full of Mafia Hoods, sitting in a small Salvation Army store-front church – in Times Sq, a sanctuary for the indigent – commanded to attend, on a bet lost by Sky Masterson, in order to make Sgt. Sarah Brown look good for The Commander!!

    There stood Nicely Nicely Johnson at the podium, leading the Congress in singing in unison, “And the people all said ‘Sit down, sit down, your rockin’ the boat”" – and, The (Mafioso) Congress sang along obediently. .

    Eric Cantor is a horse’s derriere – which is about one social-notch less disgusting than is John Boehner, who is The Derriere on The Hill, who sings for his supper to Barack Obama and Harry Reid. In this script – Mitch McConnell (Nathan Detroit) gambles away all of America’s money.

    What fools, America is populated with to have allowed these wh—-s to sell them into the gutter of the drainage system of Society’s Underbelly.

    You need to understand Cantor’s ethnicity and cultural roots to understand why he is the “Majority WIMP”; it is his Jewish-American psycho-dynamic roots; a culture that is ingrained in his genealogy – beginning in Eastern Europe – pre-WWI, of European Jews – psycho-dynamically related to Nazi-Germany, it is in his psycho-genesis: Jews who escaped Europe during the traumatic period of WWI pre-and-post – and those who escaped WWII’s Europe – will turn on any social construct that is not meeting ‘their needs’ at the moment. George Soros, a Jew of 20th c. Hungary :is a prime example of this psychological pattern. He began at age 14 helping the 3rd Reich by sabotaging Jews. There were many Jews, of reputation, who aided the 3rd R. in Germany and East Europe, and the Balkans. It is The American-Jew’s psycho-cultural heritage (though it is opposite the psycho-genesis of the Israeli Sabra): They brought their Communist-psycho-genesis with them when they took refuge in the U.S.

    The Jews of 19th & 20th c. Europe, created the holocaust of WW’s I & II – aided by the Jews of Russia – as they created Communism one step at a time, starting with Hilferding’s 19th c. development of the ideology of Social-Democracy, which took its natural course, escalating to economic-Marxist-Communism, to Lenin-cultural Communism – to Stalin’s ‘practical Fascist-Communism’ – to its apex in Europe; Someone to lead the fool Communists there: Hitler’s Fascism.

    It is in Cantor’s psycho-DNA: If his mouth is moving, he is ‘weaseling’ as he thinks – observe his mind’s energies as he attempts to tell his lies. Obama does the same – but, more skillfully – except to those of us who observe them from a point ‘outside of the box’ – both are twerps, using up mental-energy without a clue of where it is going to lead, ‘back to them’.

    As for Boehner – for as long as Sky Masterson commands him to go to church – he will. This being ‘his Commander’ – Barack Obama. (and, there is more to the story of ‘why’ than is included here).

  • aquinas215

    Where we are subjected to centralized control, the decisions, actions, and interactions available to us are restricted by the limited capabilities of the central minds.

  • highcourt

    no compromise? isn’t that a huge sign of someone who wants to be a dictator?

    • Former Republican

      There is no point in debating stupid which is what you get talking to TP/GOP . . . .

  • GraceD

    I think the republican party still has not defined its mission. It is not just the “talking points”, but the actually platform of (their) Values & beliefs.
    They talk a good game about smaller gov. but they do not put those words into actions.

    Small gov. seems to mean just doing whatever the republicans want: Do away with all the social programs, but sure keep their values in the “bedroom” of its citizens.

  • hepette

    24 BILLION is what they cost us. y? just give me a logical reason why?

  • xpatYankeeCurmudgeon

    Undeniable !
    Journolist and the Democrat Media Complex will make sure of that.

  • David Baur

    Wow amazing how many reporters don’t have a clue and are out of touch with the majority people. The Tea party and Republicans, Conservatives are much stronger now and will continue to grow. The Tea party is represented by Americans that are tired of the corruption in D.C. and that believe in the Constitution, so anybody that is foolish enough to believe that those groups are shrinking or are on the losing side clearly don’t know what they stand for, nor that they are just fighting for the country. Our Deficit is now over 100% of GDP, so unless you want to see the country fail, then you should be concerned as well. The latest debacle over the debt ceiling was all caused because Congress did not include funding for Obamacare, and then the Obama Administration said “we want a Clean CR” but that is media speak, as anybody that knows the law knows that Congress is allowed to not fund portions. In return they asked for three simple things, 1. That D.C. Politicians to exclude themselves from something the people will also have to do 2. That the Medical Device Tax be removed and 3. that the people of the U.S. also be given a 1 year postponement, just like big companies got. These are all fair things, so anybody trying to make another argument out of this are just uneducated, and if they know that and don’t agree then they are just choosing to be corrupt as well. All this Blame from people towards the Tea Party just prove how clueless they truly are.

  • David Baur

    I disagree, we voted him to office just so he could do this. I am tired of the Corruption and D.C. not representing the people that voted them into office. Anybody complaining about Ted Cruz is not educated by anything other than the media.

    • Paul Browne

      Have you seen Cruz speak? He’s laughable. He has become a laughing stock and is now hated by the mainstream Republicans ,as well as the Democrats. It will be great to watch him destroying the repubs from within over the next year.

      • David Baur

        I have seen him speak several times, and his popularity with Texas has skyrocketed. He gets tons of standing ovations, so I guess you are the Heckler in the crowd. He is only hated by RHINO republicans , and I would bet my life the RHINOS are now of the chopping blocks. You forget, we the people elect these guys, CRUZ stands for what Texans wanted: No More working for D.C., you work for the People Texas and we want the Socialist ways, Corrupt Politicians GONE.

        • Paul Browne

          Cruz is a pimple on the elephant’s butt. Eventually his pustule will burst. It won’t be pleasant, and it will stink a bit, but it will remove the poisonous pus.
          Cruz gets standing ovations from crowds that are just as bonkers as he is. He doesn’t get any recognition from the general public.
          Cruz is well suited to Texas. Why don’t you secede? Oh, I forgot you need the Federal Aid, because you’re a taker State.

          • 501st

            Wrong again, Texas actually pays more Federal dollars in than it takes out. You not knowing that says all anybody needs to know about you

          • Paul Browne

            Yes, I know it does. It takes 91 cents for every $1 it pays in. Very unusual for a red state.

            I just wanted to see you get at least one point right. Congratulations on finally finding a verifiable fact.
            How does it feel?

  • David Baur

    actually, the old Republicans that are corrupt are known as RHINOS silly. That is the lamest, no facts, uneducated comment I have seen in some time.

    • CommanderBond

      Yes, but the definition of RINO keeps moving further to the right. Reagan would be a modern-day Democrat by current GOP standards.

    • Paul Browne

      As the delusional Tea baggers move further and further to the extreme right, they label everybody to the left of Hitler, as the looney left.

      Any actual old style republicans are being pushed towards the Democrats or towards excluding the Tea baggers from the republican party.

      Eventually it will be you, Cruz, Bachmann, Palin, Perry, Gohmert, Alex Jones, Limbaugh and Bill O’Reilly sitting in Anne Coulter’s kitchen reminiscing about “The good old days”. Lmao!!

  • Ryan Saylor

    Our Chicago thug of a president has received ZERO bounce since the shutdown. I love what the Tea Party stands for. I don’t like how they divide primaries and help Harry Reid get more votes in the Senate. Harry Reid’s liberal Senate has seen 7 years of 7 % and above unemployment and limited economic growth. Yet GOP senate candidates lost in Romney states on IN, MO, MT, and ND in 2012.However the black caucus (Maxine Waters, John Lewis, Charlie Rangel) is just as far to the left and yet gets no media criticism. A president from Chicago isn’t moderate by NO MEANS.

  • Ryan Saylor

    It is all about candidate recruitment. I do wished some of the Tea Party types would go after the OTHER side more than their own side. A divided primary leads to a victory on the other side. Harry Reid is an extremist who says coal makes us sick. In KY and WV, coal jobs are important.

  • Atlas Shirked

    I have liberal friends in Austin. They are pissed. Pissed that the roll-out was “problematic”, pissed that Tea Party economic terrorists continue to attempt to derail or otherwise scuttle a program not yet tested.

    The games insurers play with the ACA exchange may not be fixed in less than a year; but, this is irrelevant because the economy will be healthy enough for the Senate to remain Dem.

    The “long” game looks like a relatively healthy economy for 2016, radical GOP elements of which people grow tired, and an ACA that has correct the majority of issues with pricing differentials across states.

  • Paul Browne

    There is slightly more likelihood of Ted Cruz becoming the next US President, as there is of Ozzy Osbourne becoming the next Pope……………. very slightly more.

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